1 person in flight deck rule?

[BoeingDriver99]

The pilot demographic suffer from suicide, suicide-ideation & depression at a higher rate than the general population. It’s covered in the Medical forum and the studies are available online.

[greybeard]

Diil of F/O

I had a different scene, F/O goes to cabin, no cc available, needed to GO.

OK, BUT used the old door handle lock by I hope accident, Now he is in cabin, door is locked, no key as has been removed.

We had 2 deadbolts fitted to door which were open.

Guess who has to open the door.

No prises for guessing

[PEI_3721]

"higher rate than the general population"

How many aircraft events have there been in the last 20 yrs; how many resulted in fatalities.
How does this risk - a fatal outcome, compare with other risks in aviation ?

The risk probabilities could be sufficiently low not to warrant any special procedure, ALARP; particularly if the new procedure could introduce a low level hazard, but one which would be encountered much more frequently.

[Kiltrash]

From. SLF view one suicidal pilot would kill at max 450. ( when was the last proven one?) And if it's my flight hard cheese wrong place wrong time. However how many people die Worldwide due to single occupancy drivers that are Drunk, Drugs or even Medicalky incapacitated. ??.
However for the inconvenience of a CC occupying the jump seat with a override door unlock switch that does give Passengers and the Airlines a simple another level of security...
Q When was the last successful Hijack of a Airliner??

[smith]

Do you think the German wings f/o would have crashed it if the captain hadn't decided to take a slash? Was it an opportune moment for him or had he been waiting a while to do it as it's not very often on short haul flights that either of the pilots take a slash. I do think an FA on the flight deck is a good idea. Most failures on-board an aircraft have tiny little risk factors so even a pilot incapacitation while one is in the bog, is an infinitesimal risk, having an FA there provides redundancy of alerting the out of office pilot and head not coming back to a fd in chaos.

[FullWings]

Originally Posted by smith

Do you think the German wings f/o would have crashed it if the captain hadn't decided to take a slash? Was it an opportune moment for him or had he been waiting a while to do it as it's not very often on short haul flights that either of the pilots take a slash. I do think an FA on the flight deck is a good idea. Most failures on-board an aircraft have tiny little risk factors so even a pilot incapacitation while one is in the bog, is an infinitesimal risk, having an FA there provides redundancy of alerting the out of office pilot and head not coming back to a fd in chaos.

Maybe. But what’s the risk of a recently recruited or “sleeper” CC using that opportunity to do their own bit of suiciding or hijacking? Much easier with only one pilot in the cockpit who’s facing forward and strapped in...

When deciding policy, those accountable have to examine all the factors they can reasonably think of, and in my outfit they decided against implementation of this rule probably because in the cold light of day it didn’t really add up and was seen as security theatre (or making the situation worse). There is also the fact that you are taking CC out of service, possibly at a busy time and you have one less person to monitor and/or perform SEP functions in the cabin. All that has to be added up and weighed against alternatives.

[vegassun]

I was told that having a FA up front when one pilot leaves is to have someone there to open fortified door if the remaining pilot becomes incapacitated for whatever reason. Yes I am fully aware of the keypad on the outside of the door that is supposed to unlock door.

[wiggy]

Originally Posted by FullWings

Maybe. But what’s the risk of a recently recruited or “sleeper” CC using that opportunity to do their own bit of suiciding or hijacking? Much easier with only one pilot in the cockpit who’s facing forward and strapped in...

When deciding policy, those accountable have to examine all the factors they can reasonably think of, and in my outfit they decided against implementation of this rule probably because in the cold light of day it didn’t really add up and was seen as security theatre (or making the situation worse). There is also the fact that you are taking CC out of service, possibly at a busy time and you have one less person to monitor and/or perform SEP functions in the cabin. All that has to be added up and weighed against alternatives.

Yep, agreed.

There’s tendency to get fixated on one threat to the exclusion of all else. I think a lot of the thinking is out in the public domain now, so I think it’s safe to say having an FA on the flight deck raises issues all of it’s own that may actually not lead to an improvement in safety and security..in fact in some circumstance it might increase risks.

Hence the decision by (most?) regulators to allow airlines to make their own policy.

https://flightsafety.org/two-in-the-cockpit/

[sudden twang]

Isn’t there a bulletin out for the FD lock which can fail meaning it has to be opened using an override. The door cannot be unlocked electronically from either side.

[Junkflyer]

Its not a bad idea to have a second person if for some reason the pilot becomes incapacitated.

[HandsomeHarry]

Be interesting to see if the support shown in this thread for the CC to babysit the remaining pilot is coming from pilots, management types or SLF

Personally can’t understand why any pilot would be in favour of this SOP.

[Johnny F@rt Pants]

The airline that I work for has always done it, way way before the Germanwings incident.

[Lascaille]

Originally Posted by HandsomeHarry

Be interesting to see if the support shown in this thread for the CC to babysit the remaining pilot is coming from pilots, management types or SLF

Personally can’t understand why any pilot would be in favour of this SOP.

Oddly derogatory to a safety of life role to call it 'babysitting'

Strange things happen, you know. People can sometimes spontaneously spasm and swallow their tongue, to be a bit ludicrous.

It's always good to have a second person close at hand. I can't think of any task where a 2nd party is a hindrance (unless they're a total muppet and hindering the job, but that's a personnel problem, not a concept problem.)

[HandsomeHarry]

Originally Posted by Lascaille

Oddly derogatory to a safety of life role to call it 'babysitting'

Strange things happen, you know. People can sometimes spontaneously spasm and swallow their tongue, to be a bit ludicrous.

It's always good to have a second person close at hand. I can't think of any task where a 2nd party is a hindrance (unless they're a total muppet and hindering the job, but that's a personnel problem, not a concept problem.)

It’s an inconvenience, you can dress it up as safety all you like and try and justify it.

The chances of the remaining crew member falling over, having a fit or some other random theory I’ve seen posted is so remote you’ve more chance of being struck by lightning.

More so, even if any these ridiculous theories did come to pass then you’ve got the added safety barrier of the emergency access code.

Thankfully our lot don’t require us to be looked after by the crew, although it was a temporary procedure after Germanwings, the company thankfully were grown up enough to trust their workforce.

[MerseyView]

To those supporting this policy, what do you think the remaining pilot does when joined by the CC member? Continues full Person Monitoring duties, or pays less attention to the aforementioned and chats to CC member?

[Wheelnut69]

Originally Posted by HandsomeHarry

It’s an inconvenience, you can dress it up as safety all you like and try and justify it.

The chances of the remaining crew member falling over, having a fit or some other random theory I’ve seen posted is so remote you’ve more chance of being struck by lightning.
.

Planes (and people) are often struck by lightning. To me it seems a no brainer to mitigate a (albeit a very small) risk with no real downside.

[Lascaille]

If they're the only person on the flight deck I would very much assume they're PF, and also that they'd be professional. Seems odd to assume otherwise.

[BoeingDriver99]

This thread is populated by people who have quite obviously no clue about mental health issues and/or airline SOPs. To those of you who post with such obvious ignorance; I wish I had such false confidence. Now STFU & go post on an anti-vax group on Facebook.

A suicide/murder human dissuaded by boobs. Are you f@&£ng serious? “Today I want to die and also kill 100+ people…. OH LOOK! BOOBIES! Now let’s just return to ops normal and land.” How stupid does this process sound to you? I mean seriously; how stupid do you have to be to think this makes any sense whatsoever?

The concept of introducing a cabin crew to monitor the remaining pilot in a modern airliner is only slightly less dumb. Allowing someone with a few weeks of ‘training’ on how to open a door and serve food to a bunch of animals to spend a significant amount of time in the cockpit is quite beyond hilarious.

Has anyone ever seriously attempted to defend themselves from an assault from a seated position whilst attacked from behind? With an axe?!? An obese 50+ bloke versus a 20+ ideologically driven man from behind? Errrr… if this is a concept you are unclear about then that’s okay, back to Candy Crush & breathing through your mouth, enjoy the first stroke when it occurs.

Consider the FedEx 705 incident. It wasn’t an accident. An a@@hole determinedly decided to rock up at work and tried to crash the aircraft.

Please, please, please someone tell me that a skanky pair of tits would have changed his mind? I need another good laugh today.

And on the other hand; Boeing have destroyed their own company by creating a monstrosity that killed more people by accident than any suicidal/individual pilot. Show more boobies to the max? Problem solved? This is how stupid you sound.

People are so f@&£ing stupid.

Single pilot operations aren’t the future. The future is fully autonomous airliners. Human controlled airliners have already started the countdown to obsolescence.

[iggy]

Originally Posted by BoeingDriver99

...to a bunch of animals...

I salute you, Sir.

[Herod]

BoeingDriver99. Can we assume you have never travelled as a passenger, or can we lump you together with the "animals" the cabin crew are feeding?
I'd also like to question your mental health. There was one post about a cabin-crew flashing her boobs, but you seem fixated on it. Fantasise about boobs all you like, but don't go on about them on what should be a professional site.