Landing areas
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Landing areas
I hope that this is the correct forum to ask this question
I am currently planning an emergency test for a power station and am looking for brief info on what size of landing area an air ambulance would require to land in before exavcuating out casualties.
The info I require :-
Size and type of landing area required
How close to the casualty in ideal circumstances
How far away from power lines both live (440Kv) and inactive
I realise that its a strange request but happy to provide more details via PM
I am currently planning an emergency test for a power station and am looking for brief info on what size of landing area an air ambulance would require to land in before exavcuating out casualties.
The info I require :-
Size and type of landing area required
How close to the casualty in ideal circumstances
How far away from power lines both live (440Kv) and inactive
I realise that its a strange request but happy to provide more details via PM
2 x the rotor diameter for daytime landings and 3 x rotor diameter for night. This is the actual size of the touchdown point. Surface to be contaminant free (loose articles, debris etc) and firm and level (tarmac, grass, NOT gravel!!!).
The surrounding area out to as far as possible, should be free from main obstructions such as buildings power cables, masts etc.
[Or atleast a swathe of area predominently into the prevailing wind direction]. If you can afford it, the area needs to be lit for night ops and a wind sock would be nice too!
Presumably the casualty will be brought to the helo, so proximity to patient is not an issue?
Distance from 440Kv cables. We operate out of a site with 132 Kv cables and have been told by Manweb that the physical distance should be no nearer than 50'
(which I think is blo**y small. For permanent residence in the vicinity of these cables, no closer than 180m due to ionisation of the atmosphere!
The surrounding area out to as far as possible, should be free from main obstructions such as buildings power cables, masts etc.
[Or atleast a swathe of area predominently into the prevailing wind direction]. If you can afford it, the area needs to be lit for night ops and a wind sock would be nice too!
Presumably the casualty will be brought to the helo, so proximity to patient is not an issue?
Distance from 440Kv cables. We operate out of a site with 132 Kv cables and have been told by Manweb that the physical distance should be no nearer than 50'
(which I think is blo**y small. For permanent residence in the vicinity of these cables, no closer than 180m due to ionisation of the atmosphere!
Try ; www.bhab.flyer.co.uk; that will give you all the info on setting up sites.
I would agree with sycamore that a visit to the BHAB site is a good first port of call. In case you are tempted by Thomas coupling's advice, you should be aware that it is not quite correct; the dimensions for a HEMS site is contained below as is the correct definition of 'D'. At the bottom of this post is the guidance provided for operators to be used when selecting a site for a heliport.
As this is a premeditated use of a heliport, it would be difficult to argue that it constitutes a HEMS site (which is more normally an accident site)
IEM to Appendix 1 to JAR-OPS 3.005(d), sub-paragraph (c)(2)(i)(C) HEMS operating site
See Appendix 1 to JAR-OPS 3.005(d) sub-paragraph (c)(2)(i)(C)
JAR-OPS 3.005(d)
AMC No 1 to OPS 3.220
Authorisation of Heliports by the operator
See JAR-OPS 3.220
As this is a premeditated use of a heliport, it would be difficult to argue that it constitutes a HEMS site (which is more normally an accident site)
IEM to Appendix 1 to JAR-OPS 3.005(d), sub-paragraph (c)(2)(i)(C) HEMS operating site
See Appendix 1 to JAR-OPS 3.005(d) sub-paragraph (c)(2)(i)(C)
JAR-OPS 3.005(d)
AMC No 1 to OPS 3.220
Authorisation of Heliports by the operator
See JAR-OPS 3.220
JimL: cut the guy some slack.
(a) He isn't an aviator. So dont confuse him with JAR Ops3!
(b) It isnt a designated HEMS site, simply somewhere for casualty evacuation.
(c ) Which HEMS unit do you know of that does HEMS at night in Scotland?
It's far easier for ALL concerned, including the owner of the land, to treat this as an ad-hoc landing site for day or night Ops. All he has to do is clear some suitable land to accomodate the biggest helo that operates in those parts that 'may' do a casualty evac.
You don't work for the CAA do you in the 'trees' department???
(a) He isn't an aviator. So dont confuse him with JAR Ops3!
(b) It isnt a designated HEMS site, simply somewhere for casualty evacuation.
(c ) Which HEMS unit do you know of that does HEMS at night in Scotland?
It's far easier for ALL concerned, including the owner of the land, to treat this as an ad-hoc landing site for day or night Ops. All he has to do is clear some suitable land to accomodate the biggest helo that operates in those parts that 'may' do a casualty evac.
You don't work for the CAA do you in the 'trees' department???
Thomas:
The fact that he is not an aviator (if that is correct) is more reason for him to seek advice and for it not to be too casual - hence the advice by sycamore for him to visit the BHAB site.
I am not quite sure why you are averse to the correct information being given even if it does comes from JAR-OPS 3 - after all it was not written on the spur of the moment.
It was also in my mind that your post needed some comment/correction - however, I am sorry if it has caused you some offence!
The fact that he is not an aviator (if that is correct) is more reason for him to seek advice and for it not to be too casual - hence the advice by sycamore for him to visit the BHAB site.
I am not quite sure why you are averse to the correct information being given even if it does comes from JAR-OPS 3 - after all it was not written on the spur of the moment.
It was also in my mind that your post needed some comment/correction - however, I am sorry if it has caused you some offence!
jimL, I think the scenario in this case is "Oh ****, we've had an accident and need the air ambulance. Where can it land" rather than "Right, we've been having serious accidents every week for a while, so it might be a good idea to set up a permanent helipad for the air ambulance", so TC's answer is probably the right one.
Purveyor of Egg Liqueur to Lucifer
Going back to the original post;
"I am currently planning an emergency test for a power station ...."
and then later;
"Thats perfect, gives me something to work on for the exercise."
As this is a pre planned exercise, I think it fair to say this is not going to be an 'Ad-Hoc' landing.
"I am currently planning an emergency test for a power station ...."
and then later;
"Thats perfect, gives me something to work on for the exercise."
As this is a pre planned exercise, I think it fair to say this is not going to be an 'Ad-Hoc' landing.
JimL: no offence taken. Your reference was correct and for a formal application for a dedicated landing site - bang on.
What concerns me sometimes is that bureaucracy can stiffle an action plan like this. Which does nothing for promoting heli ops in this country. Anyone who wants helos as part of their infrastructure gets my support all the way. We dont want to frighten them off, on the other hand we dont want them going down the wrong road either. I'd hoped my 'offering' was somewhere in the middle.
What I suggested is legal and practical for what he wants to do, it is also very very cost effective.
No doubt SS will comment again
What concerns me sometimes is that bureaucracy can stiffle an action plan like this. Which does nothing for promoting heli ops in this country. Anyone who wants helos as part of their infrastructure gets my support all the way. We dont want to frighten them off, on the other hand we dont want them going down the wrong road either. I'd hoped my 'offering' was somewhere in the middle.
What I suggested is legal and practical for what he wants to do, it is also very very cost effective.
No doubt SS will comment again
landing areas
Cuthbeg, I think you may have had a dyslexic keyboard in your first post, as you`ll also need a big JCB if you are excavating casualties !! If you already know what type of helo will be used,work on it`s dimensions; if you don`t know, it would be useful to work your site size around the largest.ie S-61/S-King, or if military may be involved , possibly even a Chinook; that will leave you with a severe downwash problem, so make sure any portaloos are well dug-in!!! Otherwise, the bigger , the better, for any HLS.Syc.
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Thanks for all the replies.
Just and update as I said Im planning an emergency test at a power station in which the emergency services will be involved, the only omission was air ambulance.
I surveyed the site last week and have found (what I think) is a suitable site as per the specs on the replies. A grass football field approx 150 m x 60 m with no cables overhead or around it but it has trees on 3 sides but can see no interference there. For the purpose of the exercise this will be all that can be provided.
You are correct that this will be an ad hoc landing area as, luckily we do not have accidents or incidents which require this facility on a regular basis, but I should say that I will be recommending in the report that there should be a detailed survey performed for more suitable landing area for helicopters at the site for these rare occurences, maybe the football field is the place, I dont know but its something that has to be considered.
Again thanks to all for taking the time and effort to reply
Just and update as I said Im planning an emergency test at a power station in which the emergency services will be involved, the only omission was air ambulance.
I surveyed the site last week and have found (what I think) is a suitable site as per the specs on the replies. A grass football field approx 150 m x 60 m with no cables overhead or around it but it has trees on 3 sides but can see no interference there. For the purpose of the exercise this will be all that can be provided.
You are correct that this will be an ad hoc landing area as, luckily we do not have accidents or incidents which require this facility on a regular basis, but I should say that I will be recommending in the report that there should be a detailed survey performed for more suitable landing area for helicopters at the site for these rare occurences, maybe the football field is the place, I dont know but its something that has to be considered.
Again thanks to all for taking the time and effort to reply
