The Bush Exclusion Zone
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The Bush Exclusion Zone
London ppruners will be aware that The Specified Area and H4 are off limits until Friday lunchtime. The controlling authority (according to NOTAM) is the Met Police and they have told both BBC & Sky News to p**s off - they will not let them into the area. The BBC even offered to have a Special Branch officer fly with them - and got nowhere.
What's the feeling on the legalities of all of this ? Does the ANO allow the Met Police to just put up any sort of exclusion and bar genuine operators/professionals from doing their jobs ?
Where's this all heading ? I understand that the BBC have consulted m'learned friends.
What's the feeling on the legalities of all of this ? Does the ANO allow the Met Police to just put up any sort of exclusion and bar genuine operators/professionals from doing their jobs ?
Where's this all heading ? I understand that the BBC have consulted m'learned friends.
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I agree with your concerns. Twins can't get Brent - Battersea at the moment of course. All extra delays for users.
The thing that I thought was even stranger, was the fact that the TRA goes up to 6000 feet. Why?? As LHR and Battersea are exempt, what else is likely to be in the TMA anyway???
Furthermore, watching the news you may have seen people outside Buck Pal and driving past!!!
Seems a little pointless to me.
The thing that I thought was even stranger, was the fact that the TRA goes up to 6000 feet. Why?? As LHR and Battersea are exempt, what else is likely to be in the TMA anyway???
Furthermore, watching the news you may have seen people outside Buck Pal and driving past!!!
Seems a little pointless to me.
The thing that I thought was even stranger, was the fact that the TRA goes up to 6000 feet. Why?? As LHR and Battersea are exempt, what else is likely to be in the TMA anyway???
Furthermore, watching the news you may have seen people outside Buck Pal and driving past!!!
Seems a little pointless to me."
Perhaps they don't have the time to identify light aircraft that make a sudden deviation from the Thames and head for Dubyas digs.. But would they really just pop off a surface to air missle at anything unauthorised and heading toward the mall?
Or is it more likely that they give themselves a little extra time to push Dubya under the nearest table if the exclusion zone is that little bit bigger.
Also there are interesting temporary camps around London at the moment that are hard to hide from a airborne 70 to 1 lens... but a detective plod on board would eliminate the risk of broadcasting a picture of a ground to air missle battery manned by men in black
Mickjoebill
Furthermore, watching the news you may have seen people outside Buck Pal and driving past!!!
Seems a little pointless to me."
Perhaps they don't have the time to identify light aircraft that make a sudden deviation from the Thames and head for Dubyas digs.. But would they really just pop off a surface to air missle at anything unauthorised and heading toward the mall?
Or is it more likely that they give themselves a little extra time to push Dubya under the nearest table if the exclusion zone is that little bit bigger.
Also there are interesting temporary camps around London at the moment that are hard to hide from a airborne 70 to 1 lens... but a detective plod on board would eliminate the risk of broadcasting a picture of a ground to air missle battery manned by men in black
Mickjoebill
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At least they have NOTAMed it this time.
I tried to get into the Heliroutes when Dubya's predecessor was in town and was told by a rather stressed Controller at special (CIA man holding a gun to his head?) that the routes were off limits due to "priority traffic". Nothing in the NOTAMs and since I had just passed Rainbow 01 going the other way (whose flight plan was NOTAMed) I thought this a little strange. It was only when an American accent come on frequency declaring himself as Marine 01 - a flight of SIX helo's - it all became aparent. The President of the US of A was in town and strutting around like he owned the place.
Once they were in uncontrolled airspace I followed them, which up set them.
I tried to get into the Heliroutes when Dubya's predecessor was in town and was told by a rather stressed Controller at special (CIA man holding a gun to his head?) that the routes were off limits due to "priority traffic". Nothing in the NOTAMs and since I had just passed Rainbow 01 going the other way (whose flight plan was NOTAMed) I thought this a little strange. It was only when an American accent come on frequency declaring himself as Marine 01 - a flight of SIX helo's - it all became aparent. The President of the US of A was in town and strutting around like he owned the place.
Once they were in uncontrolled airspace I followed them, which up set them.
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The BBC and SKY deserve everything they get after their shocking coverage of the war...
And it's only for a couple of days anyway. Moreover, the NOTAM I saw stated that the TRA didn't apply to aircraft operating with clearance from Heathrow Radar or LATCC (might just be mil ac though, willing to stand corrected).
We (the UK) would not be forgiven by history if something were to happen that could have been prevented by something as simple as a TRA.
And it's only for a couple of days anyway. Moreover, the NOTAM I saw stated that the TRA didn't apply to aircraft operating with clearance from Heathrow Radar or LATCC (might just be mil ac though, willing to stand corrected).
We (the UK) would not be forgiven by history if something were to happen that could have been prevented by something as simple as a TRA.
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Bush Exclusion Zone
Count yourselves lucky! When he visited Canberra all Charter and Aerial work was grounded for 2 days unless you wanted to fly out of the control zone. No training and as for the press - stay out of the airspace or you will be shot down... We lost 2 days business and no there was absolutely nothing we could do about it.
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SARBOY: "The BBC and SKY deserve everything they get after their shocking coverage of the war... "
No doubt, you are of the "embedded journalists tell the truth" brigade ?
Oh yes. Let's punish Sky and the BBC by restricting freedom and the rights of the UK people to have independent coverage of a major national event.
People like you are the reason why we need a freedom of information act. Maybe you could explain exactly what threat you perceive from the BBC and Sky crews in their twin AS355s operating under AOC's from reputable UK operators ?
This week has been tantamount to a "D" notice - and for what real reason ?
No doubt, you are of the "embedded journalists tell the truth" brigade ?
Oh yes. Let's punish Sky and the BBC by restricting freedom and the rights of the UK people to have independent coverage of a major national event.
People like you are the reason why we need a freedom of information act. Maybe you could explain exactly what threat you perceive from the BBC and Sky crews in their twin AS355s operating under AOC's from reputable UK operators ?
This week has been tantamount to a "D" notice - and for what real reason ?
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Steady on headsethair. I guess SARboy is military and you aren't. No doubt the military have a very different view of war journalism than those of us who are consumers. Just remember that a camera only has a narrow angle of view and can therefore only record a small fraction of a story. From my own experience, journos can get stories very mixed up, either an honest mistake or to make good headlines. SARBOY may well have a broader picture.
Back to the main thread, I dont believe that BBC & Sky were specifically targeted in this TRA - it applies to all traffic to stop terrorists doing what they do best. However it is wrong IMHO to go so over board with restrictions in this country - it seems like London had been turned into a military state.
Back to the main thread, I dont believe that BBC & Sky were specifically targeted in this TRA - it applies to all traffic to stop terrorists doing what they do best. However it is wrong IMHO to go so over board with restrictions in this country - it seems like London had been turned into a military state.
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Crashondeck : "I guess SARboy is military and you aren't."
Well - steady on, yourself. I have every respect for the military and have worked alongside them on numerous occasions. That wasn't my argument - and your response is just so typical of people who always have to create a "them" and an "us".
The facts we all know are that an exclusion zone does little to stop the bad boys - and everything to prevent our freedom. It's just not right. Does anyone really think that the "clear and present" danger is from an AS355 doing a news job ?
Please bear in mind that no broadcaster was allowed to show live coverage of Bush landing at LHR. This is unwarranted censorship.
Well - steady on, yourself. I have every respect for the military and have worked alongside them on numerous occasions. That wasn't my argument - and your response is just so typical of people who always have to create a "them" and an "us".
The facts we all know are that an exclusion zone does little to stop the bad boys - and everything to prevent our freedom. It's just not right. Does anyone really think that the "clear and present" danger is from an AS355 doing a news job ?
Please bear in mind that no broadcaster was allowed to show live coverage of Bush landing at LHR. This is unwarranted censorship.
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Genghis, since there is a permanent flight restriction over Washington, D.C. and Camp David (P40), it is difficult to say for certain. I would imagine that the same applies to other Heads of State, but I can't remember the last time somebody went to a location other than Washington or Camp David.
That said, we get the same problems in the U.S. when Dubya is on a road trip. However, the TFR's can actually change within a few minutes and pilots have been busted by not checking. You literally have to check before EACH and EVERY flight. Example...
Friend of mine was flying Long Ranger from Delaware to Maryland. Dubya was supposed to be in Philladelphia that afternoon, so the TFR was scheduled to go into affect at 3 p.m. (affecting southern Delaware). Before heading back, the pilot was fueling up and walked into the FBO. He happen to overhear other pilots mention that the Philly TFR was going to go into affect at 2 p.m.
A little confused, he called up FSS and he was told... "oh, they moved it up an hour!" He had to jump in and take off immediately in order to make it back before the TFR went into affect. The change took place in the time for one short flight! The AOPA has been complaining about this for a long time, but nothing changes.
That said, we get the same problems in the U.S. when Dubya is on a road trip. However, the TFR's can actually change within a few minutes and pilots have been busted by not checking. You literally have to check before EACH and EVERY flight. Example...
Friend of mine was flying Long Ranger from Delaware to Maryland. Dubya was supposed to be in Philladelphia that afternoon, so the TFR was scheduled to go into affect at 3 p.m. (affecting southern Delaware). Before heading back, the pilot was fueling up and walked into the FBO. He happen to overhear other pilots mention that the Philly TFR was going to go into affect at 2 p.m.
A little confused, he called up FSS and he was told... "oh, they moved it up an hour!" He had to jump in and take off immediately in order to make it back before the TFR went into affect. The change took place in the time for one short flight! The AOPA has been complaining about this for a long time, but nothing changes.
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It's getting ridiculous
This from DC:
At least part of the White House was evacuated Thursday after a false radar reading mistakenly indicated that a plane flew within five miles of restricted airspace around the complex, officials said. _
"It's a false radar target," said William Shumann, Federal Aviation Administration spokesman. "When the NORAD fighters got to the location of the alleged violation, they found nothing."
The North American Aerospace Defense Command, or NORAD, is the command center for the defense of U.S. and Canadian airspace.
Shumann said flocks of birds or atmospheric disturbances can cause false radar returns. "It's one of those electronic gremlins that pops up, but there was no aircraft there."
Meanwhile - no sign of a Londonwide exclusion zone for large speeding trucks like the one used in Istanbul today.......
OK - I'm going for a lighten-up session.
"I only told you to sack my cook" said a high-ranking Royal to a butler.
At least part of the White House was evacuated Thursday after a false radar reading mistakenly indicated that a plane flew within five miles of restricted airspace around the complex, officials said. _
"It's a false radar target," said William Shumann, Federal Aviation Administration spokesman. "When the NORAD fighters got to the location of the alleged violation, they found nothing."
The North American Aerospace Defense Command, or NORAD, is the command center for the defense of U.S. and Canadian airspace.
Shumann said flocks of birds or atmospheric disturbances can cause false radar returns. "It's one of those electronic gremlins that pops up, but there was no aircraft there."
Meanwhile - no sign of a Londonwide exclusion zone for large speeding trucks like the one used in Istanbul today.......
OK - I'm going for a lighten-up session.
"I only told you to sack my cook" said a high-ranking Royal to a butler.
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"I only told you to sack my cook" said a high-ranking Royal to a butler.
Much as I don't like exclusion zones, I feel that with the terrorist threat being so high at the moment they are a necessary evil. I think the basic theory is, 'if you keep the good guys out, then those left are the bad guys and they can be dealt with as required'.
Fly safely,
Chopperman
