Help needed with legal scenario...
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Just to get this straight - Peter started the flight under visual flight rules, but once he was flying in cloud (with zero visibility) and out of sight of the ground he was then operating under Instrument flight rules? Would I be required to mention something along the lines that in order to be able to fly in such conditions Peter would require an IMC rating?
VFR in cloud must therefore be possible?
He would only be flying IFR OCAS at quadrantle levels so if not at those levels not IFR!
Pace
Last edited by Pace; 18th Nov 2010 at 17:05.
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aviation
Section 1 article 115 of the Air Navigation Order 2005 states that,
“A person shall not act as an air traffic controller if he knows or suspects that he is suffering from or, having regard to the circumstances of the period of duty to be undertaken, is likely to suffer from, such fatigue as may endanger the safety of any aircraft to which an air traffic control service may be provided
also , in peter case if hes instruments rating has expired , which meant that he could not fly under the Instrument Flight Rules (IFR) and could only be able to fly under the Visual Flight Rules (VFR). Its also a falsified entries ,
Read my message , i might have the useful stuff for you.......
Jack
“A person shall not act as an air traffic controller if he knows or suspects that he is suffering from or, having regard to the circumstances of the period of duty to be undertaken, is likely to suffer from, such fatigue as may endanger the safety of any aircraft to which an air traffic control service may be provided
also , in peter case if hes instruments rating has expired , which meant that he could not fly under the Instrument Flight Rules (IFR) and could only be able to fly under the Visual Flight Rules (VFR). Its also a falsified entries ,
Read my message , i might have the useful stuff for you.......
Jack
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Pace
I think you may have managed to be wrong twice in the same sentence (or part thereof). 
Gliders cannot by their nature fly IFR in cloud but they are legal to fly in cloud with no instrumentation
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I've flown in cloud in a glider with no artificial horizon, purely by reference to the turn and slip, asi, vario and alt. I performed a 180 turn and came out again. I was wearing a parachute at the time and had plenty of height to use it. It was reassuring to know that I could do it but its not something I would resort to in anything other than the direst of situations. Its not what I would call 'habit forming'.
Sorry for the thread drift.
Sorry for the thread drift.
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Absolutely bonkers your honour
I find it odd that an Aviation Module for an LLB course goes into the guts of the ANO.
Even the LLM Air and Space Law courses do not go into the operational detail alluded at in the problem question. Please tell us more, to the extent you are not incriminating yourself for plagarism!
The simple civil legal answer is that Liz might have a negligence action against Peter for damages she can prove. Peter may have busted his aviation insurance cover, as he has breached the ANO (standard weazle words in Policy AVN1C).
Peter faces big bills and lawyers fees...
If Peter was flying with an AOC, then he will be strictly liable for damages to Liz, but only if she has bodily injury, as opposed to pschiatric injury.
On a criminal note, a CAA prosecution is probable. More bills and fees...
Even the LLM Air and Space Law courses do not go into the operational detail alluded at in the problem question. Please tell us more, to the extent you are not incriminating yourself for plagarism!
The simple civil legal answer is that Liz might have a negligence action against Peter for damages she can prove. Peter may have busted his aviation insurance cover, as he has breached the ANO (standard weazle words in Policy AVN1C).
Peter faces big bills and lawyers fees...
If Peter was flying with an AOC, then he will be strictly liable for damages to Liz, but only if she has bodily injury, as opposed to pschiatric injury.
On a criminal note, a CAA prosecution is probable. More bills and fees...
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LLB student? I don't think so. I reckon 'Aviation Unenthusiast' is in fact someone from NATS or the CAA who has dreamed up this hypothetical scenario to get us all thinking and talking about two dangerous and far too common issues, i.e. incursions into controlled airspace and unintentional then continued flight into IMC.
Nice one Sir!
Nice one Sir!
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Breach the ANO and lose your insurance.........
You read it here first - Part of the standard GA insurance policy used by the aviation insurance market - this relates to the hull claim plus any liability (to pax and third parties)....
the weasel words are "condition precedent........ before any liability"
I have seen claims denied before, on the basis of breach of the ANO, based on this policy language.........
"(B) CONDITIONS PRECEDENT APPLICABLE TO ALL SECTIONS
It is necessary that the Insured observes and fulfils the following
Conditions before the Insurers have any liability to make any
payment under this Policy.
the weasel words are "condition precedent........ before any liability"
I have seen claims denied before, on the basis of breach of the ANO, based on this policy language.........
"(B) CONDITIONS PRECEDENT APPLICABLE TO ALL SECTIONS
It is necessary that the Insured observes and fulfils the following
Conditions before the Insurers have any liability to make any
payment under this Policy.
Due Diligence 1. The Insured shall at all times use due diligence and do and concur in
doing everything reasonably practicable to avoid accidents and to avoid
or diminish any loss hereon.
Compliance
with Air
Navigation,
Orders etc.
2. The Insured shall comply with all air navigation and airworthiness orders
and requirements issued by any competent authority affecting the safe
operation of the Aircraft and shall ensure that
(a) the Aircraft is airworthy at the commencement of each Flight;
(b) all Log Books and other records in connection with the Aircraft which
are required by any official regulations in force from time to time
shall be kept up to date and shall be produced to the Insurers or their
Agents on request;
(c) the employees and agents of the Insured comply with such orders
and requirements"doing everything reasonably practicable to avoid accidents and to avoid
or diminish any loss hereon.
Compliance
with Air
Navigation,
Orders etc.
2. The Insured shall comply with all air navigation and airworthiness orders
and requirements issued by any competent authority affecting the safe
operation of the Aircraft and shall ensure that
(a) the Aircraft is airworthy at the commencement of each Flight;
(b) all Log Books and other records in connection with the Aircraft which
are required by any official regulations in force from time to time
shall be kept up to date and shall be produced to the Insurers or their
Agents on request;
(c) the employees and agents of the Insured comply with such orders
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I notice that Aviationunenthusiast has stopped posting a while back; The offer is still open to sit in front of a 1:500,000 chart over a beer and I can answer most of your questions? In the absence of a reply, I shall have to assume a degree of "Troll" activity...!
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As Swiss Cheese is an aviation lawyer (by the looks of it) perhaps he can offer a view on whether one can get done for writing a confession of illegal behaviour in a pilot forum?
