10000'
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: North of South
Posts: 831
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
SARM , I prefer the Clont Heim Klemmer dance , which can be found on any good compilation album of norwegian carpenters songs .
I stick to 2000 feet or therabouts cos Im scared of heights and prefer it down there Leaning is another subject and I agree with scooter boy , it is amazing how many pilots and indeed flying schools do not lean aircraft . And how many subscribe to the belief that you dont lean below certain altitudes . I believe that this is one of the reasons flying training costs so much on the UK . I forget the figures but im sure it says somehwere in the oparting manulas of most aircraft that lenaing should be done when operating at 75% power or more , give or ake dont jump on me thats from memory which may be wrong , I do know that altitude has nothing to do with it per se. How many people on here were taught to lean when learnig to fly ? I know I wasnt . I now fly a g1000 equipped 172 which is a group owned aircraft . The low price we pay for its use is based on the fuel useage as 8GPH , and we lean asap after levelling off to attain this . The Garmin is excellent for this as it has a lean assist mde that can tell you to .1 of a gallon how much you are using so you can lean very accurately . I cant say Ive ever looked properly at the fuel use at 2300rpm rfully rich but its in the region of about 11-12GPH . This is a significant fuel saving when leaned to 8GPH . Imagine how much flying schools would save if they leaned transiiting to and from their airfields and only used fully rich for manouevering etc etc this saving could then be passed down t the student , but hey hum . I have actually heard a pilot ask once why Mixture rich was in his airfield approach checks when he never touches it . Slightly off thread I l know but just adding to scooter boys bit
I stick to 2000 feet or therabouts cos Im scared of heights and prefer it down there Leaning is another subject and I agree with scooter boy , it is amazing how many pilots and indeed flying schools do not lean aircraft . And how many subscribe to the belief that you dont lean below certain altitudes . I believe that this is one of the reasons flying training costs so much on the UK . I forget the figures but im sure it says somehwere in the oparting manulas of most aircraft that lenaing should be done when operating at 75% power or more , give or ake dont jump on me thats from memory which may be wrong , I do know that altitude has nothing to do with it per se. How many people on here were taught to lean when learnig to fly ? I know I wasnt . I now fly a g1000 equipped 172 which is a group owned aircraft . The low price we pay for its use is based on the fuel useage as 8GPH , and we lean asap after levelling off to attain this . The Garmin is excellent for this as it has a lean assist mde that can tell you to .1 of a gallon how much you are using so you can lean very accurately . I cant say Ive ever looked properly at the fuel use at 2300rpm rfully rich but its in the region of about 11-12GPH . This is a significant fuel saving when leaned to 8GPH . Imagine how much flying schools would save if they leaned transiiting to and from their airfields and only used fully rich for manouevering etc etc this saving could then be passed down t the student , but hey hum . I have actually heard a pilot ask once why Mixture rich was in his airfield approach checks when he never touches it . Slightly off thread I l know but just adding to scooter boys bit
Go and get yourselves on an Aviation Medicine course, in the Baro chamber. You will learn alot about your own personal limitations indications.
Most won't notice the effects of hypoxia - because one of the effects is "Feeling Great". And this is whilst sitting in the chamber and actually expecting it.
Let alone bimbling along at 90kts trying to do your TAS calculations and watching your VSI, fumbling with the piddle pack because it is soooo cold. You'll never see hypoxia coming with such a high workload.
Most won't notice the effects of hypoxia - because one of the effects is "Feeling Great". And this is whilst sitting in the chamber and actually expecting it.
Let alone bimbling along at 90kts trying to do your TAS calculations and watching your VSI, fumbling with the piddle pack because it is soooo cold. You'll never see hypoxia coming with such a high workload.
Super-Friendly Aviator
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Reigate, UK
Age: 42
Posts: 424
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Went up to 10k a couple of weeks ago in a PA28 - didn't take long at all. Was still achieving about 400 fpm at the level off. That was in the south-west US where it was 40 deg C on the ground - it was a refreshing 5 deg C up at 10k. IAS was a bit on the low side mind 
Just wanted to tick the box
V1R
Just wanted to tick the box
V1R
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: England
Posts: 57
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Got to 10k in a 152 a few years back doing my night rating. Flew from Southend to overhead Norwich and back. Was a very clear night and you could see the Belgian coast quite clearly.
Took ages to get up there mind you.
Took ages to get up there mind you.
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Cambridgeshire
Age: 55
Posts: 182
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
PA28 Up high
About 6 weeks ago did FL180 in a PA28, The last 4000ft took forever! total sortie time till back on ground 2 hours 10 mins! Both GA pilots but we have a military experience as engineer/atc and did it professional in my view. Briefed on hypoxia (portable oxygen sets, watched each other for any tell tail signs), icing, airspace, emergencies. In the end the fpm was virtuallly nil, we selected flap at one stage to get a little lift!
NM
NM
Join Date: May 2001
Location: 75N 16E
Age: 54
Posts: 4,729
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Once you have done 10k once, it really is no big deal, even in a C152. In California, where MEA's are often 11k or higher, you have to go at 11k or 12k, and everyone does it without 02. I spent about 3 hours at 12500, and as a (then) smoker didn't really notice any side effects.
Go and rent a T206T in the USA (because it is cheap) and do FL270 for a laugh (with 02) just once....
Go and rent a T206T in the USA (because it is cheap) and do FL270 for a laugh (with 02) just once....
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: EuroGA.org
Posts: 13,787
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I don't doubt somebody gets ill at 8000ft and I never suggested otherwise - if you read what I actually wrote.
You just ought to consider seeing a doctor, and if not, then you must avoid flying on a commercial flight because you will get ill and they will have to give you oxygen, divert, whatever, and a lot of people won't be very happy about that.
You just ought to consider seeing a doctor, and if not, then you must avoid flying on a commercial flight because you will get ill and they will have to give you oxygen, divert, whatever, and a lot of people won't be very happy about that.
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: ...back of the drag curve
Age: 61
Posts: 558
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Took my J3 Cub up to 10,000ft a while back, Took quite a while to get there, but the most satisfying bit was calling Ipswich and saying "rejoining from FL100"
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Cambridge, England, EU
Posts: 3,443
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
calling Ipswich and saying "rejoining from FL100"
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Brighton. UK. (Via Liverpool).
Posts: 5,068
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Yes, I reported "field in sight" to Cambridge, as requested ... when at FL95 and still half way across East Anglia. I was told to stop being silly and call back when I had five miles to run (or whatever).
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: UK,Twighlight Zone
Posts: 0
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
When I first got my IR I still had my 152 and did quite a few airways flights in 10-12k feet. (Fully IFR equipped, GNS 430, ADF, DME, Dual Alt etc.).
IO540 is quite right that if someone is feeling noticeable ill effects at 8,000ft they have a problem. Long periods at 10,000ft without out will leave you tired and more difficulty concentrating but are not dangerous. It is only this year the CAA have started to mandate the use of O2 for the PILOT above 10,000ft. I do not put my passengers on O2 until 14,000ft.
My average sats at 10k without O2 are high 80's on O2 high 90's.
My Cessna has an 18,000ft ceiling and I have often had to get up there to avoid weather in France. 200fpm climb rate up there!
IO540 is quite right that if someone is feeling noticeable ill effects at 8,000ft they have a problem. Long periods at 10,000ft without out will leave you tired and more difficulty concentrating but are not dangerous. It is only this year the CAA have started to mandate the use of O2 for the PILOT above 10,000ft. I do not put my passengers on O2 until 14,000ft.
My average sats at 10k without O2 are high 80's on O2 high 90's.
My Cessna has an 18,000ft ceiling and I have often had to get up there to avoid weather in France. 200fpm climb rate up there!
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: North of South
Posts: 831
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
arggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh . Neither of you are correct nr do I think either of you are AME's in fact have either of you passed HPL ? I regulalrly fly commericially and never get ill . Every pilot who has studied HPL knows exactly what I put in my last thread which I am not going to repeat.As an Ex RAF tyep I have been in a baro chamber on a number of occasions and know all the effects of o2 deprivation etc etc However I think based on the info given here by the two experts I will go back to gatwick and hand in my class one and tell them they dont know what their talking about.
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: N/A
Age: 35
Posts: 82
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I managed to get a Robin HR120/200B to FL125 in only 20 minutes a couple of weeks ago, I was well chuffed.
I could of stayed up there forever, at FL125 on your own makes you feel, well, it cant be described in words, but its the best anti-depressant in the world!!!
I could of stayed up there forever, at FL125 on your own makes you feel, well, it cant be described in words, but its the best anti-depressant in the world!!!
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: London, UK
Posts: 778
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Maxdrypower, he is DEFINITELY big enough (and ugly enough!!!) to stick up for himself, but when it comes to oxygen, hypoxia and suchlike, Bose-X is something of an expert.
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: North of South
Posts: 831
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
So I assume is the CAA AME at Gatwick . I am sure he is an expert ,but when I say what I have said and it is downtrodden as if I am some sort of liar then that is not appreciated. In the PPL and atpl syllabus it clearly states that the effects of hypoxia can begin at 8000 ft . Mine began between 8500 and 9000 , consistent with the gen given by the syllabus and that given in the baro chamber in the RAF. I recently passed a class one so my health is deemed to be good . I have also recently had so many tests you wouldnt believe due to a suspected kidney issue . I am as healthy as can be , gym 4 times a week and rugby on a saturday . I just happen to show symptoms of hypoxia early . If based on the above info anyone wants to tell me what I am suffering from then by all means do so , But half the doctors in gatwick / cheshire manchester think Im A1 so surely that should be enough for people not to deride my comments when I am detailing an experience I have had . Experts they may be bit in this case I am afraid they are very wrong . Based on my personal experiences
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Leicester
Age: 34
Posts: 213
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Leave him alone everyone is different and just because someone starts getting symptoms earlier than others doesnt mean he is unwell it could boil down to the fact he has smaller lungs therefore dont take as much oxygen on each breathe. Anyway noone on here was with him so unless you were there Shut the fcuk up cause your just biaching for no reason.
David
David