BA Strike - Your Thoughts & Questions
From the CC Thread ...
Striking crew have just starting receiving ESS messages about staff travel removal, effective 14th April
As we were told that we were only removed to improve the S.T. " Budget", where's the objection ? ( or were we lied to ? )
Or .... if the striking C.C. are re-instated during ' negotiations ' we can show that Corporate B.A. can indeed change its mind, and apply the same philosophy and caring consideration to us, too ? ( remember the old BOAC slogan - BOAC Takes Good Care of You - unless you dare grow old )
And we didn't even go on strike !
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"Thank you for flying BA - we know you have a choice...."
A question from a (definitely former - are you surprised?) frequent BA flyer - if everybody who is unhappy due to their employment situation in the current economic climate would go on strike - where would it all end up? Suddenly your "thank you for choosing BA, we know you have a choice of carriers...etc.etc." has a new and very real meaning - mainly for BA.
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It's nice to see that being on strike is so much 'fun'.
On the bus we were like excited children on a school trip cheering as we past the picket lines
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"On the bus we were like excited children on a school trip cheering as we past the picket lines"
shows a mature thought through position, er... doesn't it?
shows a mature thought through position, er... doesn't it?
Over on the CC forum, a BASSA supporter posted this:
Crew who have, are and will operate throughout these periods should hang their heads in shame. A large portion of the membership are fighting to retain jobs and minimise the depth of the pay cuts so they can retain employment opportunities into the future not only for themselves but for the crews of the future.
The members who have respected the democratic decision to make this stand also have mortgages to pay and are making this stand for the benefit of all (including the strike breakers). To break rank and assist the airline and its overpaid managers only prolongs the process. The tag of a strike breaker is one you will wear for the rest of your lives and take in to your grave. The dirty looks on flights and comments at social functions will continue forever.
The members who have respected the democratic decision to make this stand also have mortgages to pay and are making this stand for the benefit of all (including the strike breakers). To break rank and assist the airline and its overpaid managers only prolongs the process. The tag of a strike breaker is one you will wear for the rest of your lives and take in to your grave. The dirty looks on flights and comments at social functions will continue forever.
The insidious note of the second paragraph only goes to illustrate the mindset of these obnoxious strikers. Who in their right mind would even WANT to go to a "social function" with people so anti-social?!
If you happen to see any example of bullying or harrassment on your BA flight, please ask for a comment card, report the incident and post the card on your return (don't give it to the crew lest a BASSA supporting CSD chooses to "accidentally lose it"). Don't be afraid to let the offending crew know you are doing it either - they have no control over your choices, eye drops and saliva excepted.
As passengers, we can play our part in ridding our national carrier of these useless people, and help to restore the airline to its former glory.
Added:
From the Scottish Herald:
Scotland faces months of strike misery after Scottish Gas engineers voted to follow British Airways cabin crew in staging industrial action. Members of the GMB union voted overwhelmingly in favour of a national walkout, with more than four-fifths of respondents backing a strike ballot. Some 8,000 members were balloted across the UK and the union said response rates were high .
Union leaders accused British and Scottish Gas of “macho management and bullying”, which they said was leading to attacks on terms and conditions of employment.
Union leaders accused British and Scottish Gas of “macho management and bullying”, which they said was leading to attacks on terms and conditions of employment.
YouTube - Sinitta - So Macho
Last edited by ChicoG; 24th Mar 2010 at 05:08. Reason: More "macho" bullsh*t
The inference made here is a thinly veiled threat, it has been reported to the authorities for investigation. Should this threat be shown to have come from a serving BA staff member then disciplinary action will surely follow.
As an aside, I too am against the strike but also think you're naive if you think turning up to work down the back is going to break the it. Or even get WW on your side - pilots are next but one on WW's hit list after some of the more entrenched ground staff. And the way you handled Open Skies doesn't bode well.
How have the authorities responded by the way?
Edit: I don't think so!!
Last edited by Dunhovrin; 24th Mar 2010 at 08:28.
And we didn't even go on strike!
?
Sure, the pilots went on strike in the ‘60s, but the present S.T. attack on pensioners is not disciplinary based, and is targetted at all ex-staff from all departments, for what reason ?
We were told that it was due to budget constraints, but the new rules actually open the floodgates for far,far, more staff numbers than the pensioners that have been kicked out, the removal of a pension to qualify greatly increases the number of participants for a start
I have repeatedly stated that I personally, but can't speak for all of course, have no rancour with the fact that present staff now get many more S.T. benefits and opportunities than we ever even dreamed of, life moves on, but don’t p**s on me to achieve your benefits – leave me and my kind alone with what we worked for and were promised, contractual or not.
My comment that we didn’t even have to go on strike to be punished, referred to the present situation.
What about 1969
Sure, the pilots went on strike in the ‘60s, but the present S.T. attack on pensioners is not disciplinary based, and is targetted at all ex-staff from all departments, for what reason ?
We were told that it was due to budget constraints, but the new rules actually open the floodgates for far,far, more staff numbers than the pensioners that have been kicked out, the removal of a pension to qualify greatly increases the number of participants for a start
I have repeatedly stated that I personally, but can't speak for all of course, have no rancour with the fact that present staff now get many more S.T. benefits and opportunities than we ever even dreamed of, life moves on, but don’t p**s on me to achieve your benefits – leave me and my kind alone with what we worked for and were promised, contractual or not.
My comment that we didn’t even have to go on strike to be punished, referred to the present situation.
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Sympathy for the strikers
First of all let me state that I am firmly behind BA on this whole saga and find it quite bizarre the Union's position.
Having said that - I used to work for BA, and in the 70's was one of the engineers standing on the picket line at Hatton Cross striking over shift pay (if I remember correctly). I was a young lad at the time and very 'wet behind the ears'. But my understanding was that the 'power' of a Union was in its solidarity. And that which ever way you voted to a call to strike, or any other voting issue, you all stood behind the majority decision whether you agreed or not.
I therefore have some sympathy with the strikers who can see Yes voters (to a strike) going in to work - if it was me I would be livid too.
If you want to belong to a union then you should abide by the rules - the massive % of the vote strike should have resulted in the grounding of BA.
Thank heavens it has not, and I fully support those that have carried on working - but I do question why most voted yes to a strike though, and I don't buy the Union lies and indoctrination line - cabin crew are not stupid - not the ones I have know anyway.
But for those not understanding why the strikers are so 'upset' on the picket lines, I can understand how they must feel - very lonely right now.
bizdev
Having said that - I used to work for BA, and in the 70's was one of the engineers standing on the picket line at Hatton Cross striking over shift pay (if I remember correctly). I was a young lad at the time and very 'wet behind the ears'. But my understanding was that the 'power' of a Union was in its solidarity. And that which ever way you voted to a call to strike, or any other voting issue, you all stood behind the majority decision whether you agreed or not.
I therefore have some sympathy with the strikers who can see Yes voters (to a strike) going in to work - if it was me I would be livid too.
If you want to belong to a union then you should abide by the rules - the massive % of the vote strike should have resulted in the grounding of BA.
Thank heavens it has not, and I fully support those that have carried on working - but I do question why most voted yes to a strike though, and I don't buy the Union lies and indoctrination line - cabin crew are not stupid - not the ones I have know anyway.
But for those not understanding why the strikers are so 'upset' on the picket lines, I can understand how they must feel - very lonely right now.
bizdev
I have a very simple choice. Take it on the chin, or look for employment elsewhere. The third option of withdrawl of labour under these circumstances is like cutting off your nose to spite your face; it will further damage an already struggling company and maybe even deal it a fatal blow.
I've chosen to take it on the chin. I enjoy my work and I'm unlikely to obtain a better deal for comparable job responsibility elsewhere.
Surely my situation is similar to BA CC who claim to love their jobs and remain on industry beating salaries, terms and conditions that they simply wouldn't obtain elsewhere. Unfortunately, many of them don't see it like that. If you put it to them that if they don't like what BA are offering they should try their luck elsewhere, the bog standard response seems to be "why should I"? And this, to me, goes to the heart of the problem. They have a huge sense of entitlement. Far too many CC seem to think that BA is run for their benefit; to provide working conditions tailored to their convenience, to support their lifestyle, to offer career opportunities. The idea that BA are a business working in a competitive environment and owned by shareholders who require a return on their investment just doesn't seem to compute.
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The latest from Unite has given me a good chuckle: -
My bold : source
Unite has condemned the move by British Airways to withdraw travel benefits from striking cabin crew - many of whom rely on the travel assistance to get to work following BA's decision to close its regional bases and require the vast majority of cabin crew to operate out of Heathrow, no matter where they may live.
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T-T-B
I heard it. They repeated all the old stuff about the evil WW & how he has withdrawn staff travel from a female CC member who has only 6 months to live. I'm not sure that Victoria Derbyshire swallowed that one.
The employment lawyer tied them up in knots. He explained that ST was non contractural with Unite's agreement in order to avoid paying income tax on benefit in kind perks. The 2 CSDs were so
that they thought he was talking about travel tax!
He also pointed out that BA have every right to fire all the strikers providing that non are re employed within 3 months. They certainly didn't like that one.
All in all I get the feeling that even the BBC has woken up to the fact that Unite are backing a losing horse. The interview was definitely not biased towards Bassa. The 2 CSDs certainly went away with their tails firmly between their legs.
The employment lawyer tied them up in knots. He explained that ST was non contractural with Unite's agreement in order to avoid paying income tax on benefit in kind perks. The 2 CSDs were so
that they thought he was talking about travel tax!He also pointed out that BA have every right to fire all the strikers providing that non are re employed within 3 months. They certainly didn't like that one.
All in all I get the feeling that even the BBC has woken up to the fact that Unite are backing a losing horse. The interview was definitely not biased towards Bassa. The 2 CSDs certainly went away with their tails firmly between their legs.
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The latest news just shows how naive the unions are.
Did they really think that BA wouldn't go through with their threat to withdraw staff discounted travel? That perk alone must cost BA millions.
I really don't understand why the unions think they can win this one, and furthermore how they're "protecting" their members. Do they really believe that by striking and costing BA millions, they're doing the company any good - how do they propose to help their unemployed members if BA have to make mass redundancies after this strike?
Did they really think that BA wouldn't go through with their threat to withdraw staff discounted travel? That perk alone must cost BA millions.
I really don't understand why the unions think they can win this one, and furthermore how they're "protecting" their members. Do they really believe that by striking and costing BA millions, they're doing the company any good - how do they propose to help their unemployed members if BA have to make mass redundancies after this strike?
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I understood that Staff Travel was on a 'space available' basis - essentially the same as Standby. On that basis there's no real cost penalty to BA as such [BA staff use unsold seats].
However, the loss of the ability to take family and kids on cheap trips will be an unfortunate [and promised] consequence of IA.
I'm not completely clear how ST might affect the 'commuters' who live far, far away and fly into LHR to go to work. Is that a separate form of ST? As in "Home to Duty"? Otherwise some people's cosy living arrangements may be substantially screwed.
However, the loss of the ability to take family and kids on cheap trips will be an unfortunate [and promised] consequence of IA.
I'm not completely clear how ST might affect the 'commuters' who live far, far away and fly into LHR to go to work. Is that a separate form of ST? As in "Home to Duty"? Otherwise some people's cosy living arrangements may be substantially screwed.
But you cannot trust BA. Last week, the web site that if you didn't get the service (no meals in Club Europe) you would get a refund. That's been removed, and they're refusing to pay where they didn't provide the service. I flew to Nice on BA344 last Sunday, in Club Europe, operated by Titan Airways. The seat was an economy seat, there was no champagne and no meal. So it was just the same as Eurotraveller, but more expensive. Having complained, they are going to send me a £30 voucher.
I reckon they have seriously broken the contract that we (BA and I) jointly entered into, viz. that they would transport me in a given class of service.
Now if they will do that to a Gold card holder on his eleventh flight with them this year, is there any reason for their staff to trust them?
I reckon they have seriously broken the contract that we (BA and I) jointly entered into, viz. that they would transport me in a given class of service.
Now if they will do that to a Gold card holder on his eleventh flight with them this year, is there any reason for their staff to trust them?
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@ radeng ... I'd posed that question to myself, and had wondered how BA might handle some form of compensation. When I fly next month to IAD, I certainly expect to get the flatbed seat in J that I have already paid for. The food and drink is of little relative consequence [food not very special and I have to drive at the other end!].
I assume you complained to BA Exec Club?
I assume you complained to BA Exec Club?
Yes, and this is the answer:
I am extremely sorry your flight was affected by the industrial action by our cabin crew. I can appreciate how disappointed you were, especially as we failed to offer you a seat in Club Europe cabin. Please accept my apologies.
Throughout this situation, our main concern was for our customers and how it affected them. Staff worked tirelessly to try to reduce the significant impact this would have on our passengers. As a Gold Club member I appreciate this is little consolation for the frustration and difficulties you experienced.
I am also concerned that that the service you received on your recent flight to Nice was not what you would expect on a British Airways flight. Our priority was to operate as many flights as we could and this meant that we had to use alternative carriers. We did plan to make sure disruption was kept to a minimum however we know it caused problems for our passengers. Your comments will be passed on to the Customer Experience managers concerned so that we can review any plans we use in the future.
While I appreciate your reasons for asking, I am afraid I cannot refund the difference in fares of your tickets.
By way of an apology, I have, though, arranged to send you a travel voucher for £30 with my compliments. You are welcome to put it towards any published British Airways fare but not towards the cost of any booking that includes a hotel or prepaid car hire. There are a few things I need to let you know about using your voucher. It can be used by calling our reservation centre on 0844 493 0 787 but it cannot be used when booking on ba.com. The voucher is valid for one year from the date of issue and is not renewable. You must make your booking at least 10 days before you travel.
Thank you for taking the time to get in touch. As a Gold Executive Club member, your feedback is genuinely appreciated. I am sorry our service did not meet its usual high standards on this occasion and I hope it will not deter you from flying with us again.
Best regards
Jerome Pinto
British Airways Customer Relations
Your case reference is
079705
Please use the following link if you need to send us a reply:
British Airways - Email us UK Executive Club
I haven't yet decided upon a response
I am extremely sorry your flight was affected by the industrial action by our cabin crew. I can appreciate how disappointed you were, especially as we failed to offer you a seat in Club Europe cabin. Please accept my apologies.
Throughout this situation, our main concern was for our customers and how it affected them. Staff worked tirelessly to try to reduce the significant impact this would have on our passengers. As a Gold Club member I appreciate this is little consolation for the frustration and difficulties you experienced.
I am also concerned that that the service you received on your recent flight to Nice was not what you would expect on a British Airways flight. Our priority was to operate as many flights as we could and this meant that we had to use alternative carriers. We did plan to make sure disruption was kept to a minimum however we know it caused problems for our passengers. Your comments will be passed on to the Customer Experience managers concerned so that we can review any plans we use in the future.
While I appreciate your reasons for asking, I am afraid I cannot refund the difference in fares of your tickets.
By way of an apology, I have, though, arranged to send you a travel voucher for £30 with my compliments. You are welcome to put it towards any published British Airways fare but not towards the cost of any booking that includes a hotel or prepaid car hire. There are a few things I need to let you know about using your voucher. It can be used by calling our reservation centre on 0844 493 0 787 but it cannot be used when booking on ba.com. The voucher is valid for one year from the date of issue and is not renewable. You must make your booking at least 10 days before you travel.
Thank you for taking the time to get in touch. As a Gold Executive Club member, your feedback is genuinely appreciated. I am sorry our service did not meet its usual high standards on this occasion and I hope it will not deter you from flying with us again.
Best regards
Jerome Pinto
British Airways Customer Relations
Your case reference is
079705Please use the following link if you need to send us a reply:
British Airways - Email us UK Executive Club
I haven't yet decided upon a response
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Hmmm ... I have some sympathy for their position during a strike, but to offer a Gold member a hedged-in £30 voucher seems a bit rough [especially when you consider the impracticability of actually using it!]. As a lowly Blue, I'd guess I'd have got nothing!
Wouldn't the simplest thing have been to automatically credit people experiencing the reduced standards with a bucket of BA Miles [factored for class, distance etc.]? That would create a convenient 2-way loyalty situation.
Ahhhh ... but, of course, not everyone is an ExeClub member.
Ignore my self-centred dribblings.
Wouldn't the simplest thing have been to automatically credit people experiencing the reduced standards with a bucket of BA Miles [factored for class, distance etc.]? That would create a convenient 2-way loyalty situation.
Ahhhh ... but, of course, not everyone is an ExeClub member.
Ignore my self-centred dribblings.
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Two questions that come to mind, on this strike
How can BA sack people for going on strike, and do we want to live in a country where this is legal ?
If the unions won a majority to go strike why have they alienated so many of their members that they are ignoring the the outcome of the ballot?
How can BA sack people for going on strike, and do we want to live in a country where this is legal ?
If the unions won a majority to go strike why have they alienated so many of their members that they are ignoring the the outcome of the ballot?
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How can BA sack people for going on strike, and do we want to live in a country where this is legal ?
Dont think for a moment that I think thats good, I dont, but it is what it is.
As far as living in a country with such worthless labour protection laws, well, you have a vote soon to spend, spend wisely and change the country.
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@ What the Fug
Good questions.
1. They can't. It is considered unfair dismissal to sack someone for striking as long as the strike is itself legal (which I believe this one is). However, if the industrial action continues for more than 12 weeks, I believe they can be sacked. In addition, I suppose any company may consider that someone willing to break their contract to go on strike is not likely to be very supportive of the company in the future and may therefore be more likely to be made redundant in the future.
2. I think this is a VERY good question. I've seen suggestions here and elsewhere that the union may have used rather a lot of rhetoric during the vote and not been completely clear about their intentions. But I admit I don't really know
1. They can't. It is considered unfair dismissal to sack someone for striking as long as the strike is itself legal (which I believe this one is). However, if the industrial action continues for more than 12 weeks, I believe they can be sacked. In addition, I suppose any company may consider that someone willing to break their contract to go on strike is not likely to be very supportive of the company in the future and may therefore be more likely to be made redundant in the future.
2. I think this is a VERY good question. I've seen suggestions here and elsewhere that the union may have used rather a lot of rhetoric during the vote and not been completely clear about their intentions. But I admit I don't really know