Advise on C182 Options
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Also, one of our directors is halfway to his PPL, so it needs to be "L" plate friendly....
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There are a few Saratoga late models around with 300 hp engines. You might find one that is ifr. They are usually owned by carefull types. Theres an older one owned by the Alice Springs aero club used for charter that is well maintained...I think it would have too many hrs for your taste, but it is for sale.
They carry another 30 kg or so than the 182 and if you ditch an hour ortwo of fuel,then about 5 people. They are dead easy to fly, and beginner proof as well. They do Tas up to about 156 knots.
One thing about 182's. They will go all day...the airframe is rugged, and it lands on a dime. Also you can make a case for high wing aircraft on sun protection alone in australia...thats a major safety factor. I didnt really like the 182 when I first flewit, but it grows on you, and you end up loving them! Dont front load it too much,as most people dont flare them enough and often end up erecking the nose gear.
Otherwise a Cessna 206 or higher,I suppose.
They carry another 30 kg or so than the 182 and if you ditch an hour ortwo of fuel,then about 5 people. They are dead easy to fly, and beginner proof as well. They do Tas up to about 156 knots.
One thing about 182's. They will go all day...the airframe is rugged, and it lands on a dime. Also you can make a case for high wing aircraft on sun protection alone in australia...thats a major safety factor. I didnt really like the 182 when I first flewit, but it grows on you, and you end up loving them! Dont front load it too much,as most people dont flare them enough and often end up erecking the nose gear.
Otherwise a Cessna 206 or higher,I suppose.
GA-8 AIRVAN ?>>?
Hey Modesetter
What about a GA8 Airvan, high wing, 8 seats, large rear doors for farm machinery, big tyres for dirt strips - ideal for what u want! And farmers can see out a high wing when you are flying them around.
Is there any Airvan flyers out there recommend this over a 182 or A36?? I've never been in one. KP
What about a GA8 Airvan, high wing, 8 seats, large rear doors for farm machinery, big tyres for dirt strips - ideal for what u want! And farmers can see out a high wing when you are flying them around.
Is there any Airvan flyers out there recommend this over a 182 or A36?? I've never been in one. KP
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I have a couple or three thousand hours in Airvans, normally aspirated and Turbo charged. it would seem to fit the bill for this job about perfectly, except that you won't be picking one up for the price of a 182. the operating costs are about comparable to a 182, but the capacity is double. leave a few seats out and you have 4-6 pob with luggage and full fuel. cargo pod is HUGE! and doesn't affect speed or performance.
Cruise is 125-130 KTAS, exactly the same as an old 206 and most 182's. don't be fooled by the IAS (or even the indicated TAS on the special ASI rings) as the airspeed error in the 1960's (70's, 80's,90's) cessnas is way optimistic. the H model is faster, but doesn't carry anything worthwhile.
The get benefit from a turbo charged Airvan/206/182, whatever, you need to go high, and the whole oxygen thing can be a pain. so stay away from TC unless you need to go high or climb fast. For 95% of flights in country Vic 10,000 ft is heaps, VFR or IFR. Normally aspirated is definitely cheaper and less complicated for maintenance and operations.
Consider your fixed, annual costs and divide these into the annual hours flown. this can give you quite a surprise if your hours are low, especially when finance and insurance need to be considered. An Airvan will be much more expensive than an old 182 with an on condition engine to acquire, newer construction, newer design to later safety standards, greater commercial capacity means they are holding prices well, if you can find a second hander. The factory was advertising some trade ins late last year/early this year.
Forget an Islander - money pit.
Be prepared to maintain whatever you settle on to high standards and don't look for the el cheapo or shonky quick fixes. Fix things properly and you will be rewarded in the long run with significantly better reliability (and safety).
Victoria is not a huge place and even if going into southern NSW and SA 182/206 speeds are Fine as the legs are not huge. you actually need to fly a few hundred miles at a time to get a significant benefit from faster aircraft, unless they are bloody fast, and then they usually come with their own disadvantages and complications, that negate many of the advantages. (capacity, maintenance, acquisition cost/finance, complexity) although the good old 210 is not a bad option, unless you crash one, then it is very bad indeed, but you still need long legs to get the advantage. That is why they are popular up in the top end where long out and back legs mean that the extra speed can get the day's work done within FDT daily limits. VIC not so big as NT, I know that for a fact.
A 182 will work for the tasks you have indicated very well at fairly low costs even with low utilization, BUT, if you NEED greater capacity and are looking at greater annual hours (404-600) Airvan would work very well, and there's plenty of room for an esky and even a porta loo down the back with a couple or three seats out, that is 5-6 seats remaining.
Horses for courses. Do your sums. Airvan may work, or maybe stay with what you got. hire a twin when you need it, usually you won't. To get the equivalent capacity that you are indicating that you MAY need would require a Nevergo, or a chieftain and you are a world away from a 182 by then.
Hope this helps,
HD
Cruise is 125-130 KTAS, exactly the same as an old 206 and most 182's. don't be fooled by the IAS (or even the indicated TAS on the special ASI rings) as the airspeed error in the 1960's (70's, 80's,90's) cessnas is way optimistic. the H model is faster, but doesn't carry anything worthwhile.
The get benefit from a turbo charged Airvan/206/182, whatever, you need to go high, and the whole oxygen thing can be a pain. so stay away from TC unless you need to go high or climb fast. For 95% of flights in country Vic 10,000 ft is heaps, VFR or IFR. Normally aspirated is definitely cheaper and less complicated for maintenance and operations.
Consider your fixed, annual costs and divide these into the annual hours flown. this can give you quite a surprise if your hours are low, especially when finance and insurance need to be considered. An Airvan will be much more expensive than an old 182 with an on condition engine to acquire, newer construction, newer design to later safety standards, greater commercial capacity means they are holding prices well, if you can find a second hander. The factory was advertising some trade ins late last year/early this year.
Forget an Islander - money pit.
Be prepared to maintain whatever you settle on to high standards and don't look for the el cheapo or shonky quick fixes. Fix things properly and you will be rewarded in the long run with significantly better reliability (and safety).
Victoria is not a huge place and even if going into southern NSW and SA 182/206 speeds are Fine as the legs are not huge. you actually need to fly a few hundred miles at a time to get a significant benefit from faster aircraft, unless they are bloody fast, and then they usually come with their own disadvantages and complications, that negate many of the advantages. (capacity, maintenance, acquisition cost/finance, complexity) although the good old 210 is not a bad option, unless you crash one, then it is very bad indeed, but you still need long legs to get the advantage. That is why they are popular up in the top end where long out and back legs mean that the extra speed can get the day's work done within FDT daily limits. VIC not so big as NT, I know that for a fact.
A 182 will work for the tasks you have indicated very well at fairly low costs even with low utilization, BUT, if you NEED greater capacity and are looking at greater annual hours (404-600) Airvan would work very well, and there's plenty of room for an esky and even a porta loo down the back with a couple or three seats out, that is 5-6 seats remaining.
Horses for courses. Do your sums. Airvan may work, or maybe stay with what you got. hire a twin when you need it, usually you won't. To get the equivalent capacity that you are indicating that you MAY need would require a Nevergo, or a chieftain and you are a world away from a 182 by then.
Hope this helps,
HD
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Thanks for all the input and suggestions Guys.
I think for now we will hold onto the 182, and we are looking at the option of Cross-hiring a local C206 as needed.
I think for now we will hold onto the 182, and we are looking at the option of Cross-hiring a local C206 as needed.
