Virgin Blue EBA....
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Join Date: Mar 2002
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Virgin Blue EBA....
Not a lot being said about this...
Based on what I read in another post it appears the boys want a reasonable pay rise.
The beancounters are doing the usual just sign here, here and here, no there is no need to read that fine print, and we promise to let you guys play with the new shiny toys.
OR if you don't sign, all bets are off and we are going with awa's
sigh, I love Australia.
Anyway, does anyone believe that management can be trusted?
After all, QF management promised QF pilots a seat at the table for J* interantional if they signed up and then promptly turned on that little jem, forever endearing themselves to QF pilots.....
Are VB offering anything decent?
Any break through by the VB boys and girls can only be good given the current state of play.....
Based on what I read in another post it appears the boys want a reasonable pay rise.
The beancounters are doing the usual just sign here, here and here, no there is no need to read that fine print, and we promise to let you guys play with the new shiny toys.
OR if you don't sign, all bets are off and we are going with awa's
sigh, I love Australia.
Anyway, does anyone believe that management can be trusted?
After all, QF management promised QF pilots a seat at the table for J* interantional if they signed up and then promptly turned on that little jem, forever endearing themselves to QF pilots.....
Are VB offering anything decent?
Any break through by the VB boys and girls can only be good given the current state of play.....
Join Date: Sep 2003
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Sonny,
No fine print to read - because nothing has been printed yet.
No promises about new toys. It will be in black and white if you want to have a go at it.
No mention - or threats of AWA's.
The jury is still out whether its going to be decent or not. (until there is something you can actually read)
If your fishing for bites from the VB drivers, I dont think you will get many. Most know (I hope) this is not the place to get into the nitty-gritty of it all.
BB
No fine print to read - because nothing has been printed yet.
No promises about new toys. It will be in black and white if you want to have a go at it.
No mention - or threats of AWA's.
The jury is still out whether its going to be decent or not. (until there is something you can actually read)
If your fishing for bites from the VB drivers, I dont think you will get many. Most know (I hope) this is not the place to get into the nitty-gritty of it all.
BB
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Thanks Basil,
Not trying to stir anyone up, just interested.
After being the victim of a few QF EBA's, I am interested to see how yours pans out, thats all.
Cheers.
Not trying to stir anyone up, just interested.
After being the victim of a few QF EBA's, I am interested to see how yours pans out, thats all.
Cheers.
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The T & C at VB are poor now. If a weak EBA is voted up,
it will give alot of pilots the incentive to look overseas. Me included.
Presently holding onto a small thread we may be alright.
it will give alot of pilots the incentive to look overseas. Me included.
Presently holding onto a small thread we may be alright.
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New Industrial Landscape
Would an enlightened person like to tell us:
1 the ramifications of signing of on a new EBA under the new industrial laws
2 What happens at the end of an EBA signed now
3 Any benefits to signing an EBA
4 Any benefits to remaining on a current EBA.
I think this would apply not only to Virgin, but also QF, Jetstar, etc etc
I am not encouraging anyone in any direction - as these decisions you make for yourself. However, my knowledge and possibly the public knowledge at large may not be up to speed on these changes.
Can anyone help out in filling in the important details with EBA's?
1 the ramifications of signing of on a new EBA under the new industrial laws
2 What happens at the end of an EBA signed now
3 Any benefits to signing an EBA
4 Any benefits to remaining on a current EBA.
I think this would apply not only to Virgin, but also QF, Jetstar, etc etc
I am not encouraging anyone in any direction - as these decisions you make for yourself. However, my knowledge and possibly the public knowledge at large may not be up to speed on these changes.
Can anyone help out in filling in the important details with EBA's?
Join Date: May 2001
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Information!
Why is it so hard to get decent industrial information about what can and can not be done in today's industrial climate! If you need to make a decision, you start by "Gathering" all the information you can, right? Trouble is there isnt any facts & figures, just management threats, and for every ten or so management threats there is one or two response's from the pilot group.
I would love to see educational, informative information letting me know:
How the system works?
Why the system works the way it does? eg historical precedences
What has happened in the past when various options were taken
What options in the future are most likely to work/not work;
What strategic direction and what tactics the pilot group is going to use to achieve the best possible outcome for its constituents.
At the end of the day the company has the upper hand, no matter what the pilots do because the company has thousands of income sources, while most employee's have only the one.
Another reason is that empirically management pilots often start out in the pilot council's/union rep getting the background & experience to do the company job more effectively utilising the experience they gained as a union rep.
The Company has better resources, legal expertise, the public on their side and the longer they can drag out an EBA out the more they save in unpaid entitlements.
Im not here to bag anyone- everyone has a job to do and a role to play, but the pilot group (whichever pilot group you work for) is consistently outmaneouvered and outgunned (IMHO anyway).
Personally I would like to see indepth consultation with the entire industry, for example a large scale survey's of pilot T&C's, experience, problems, challenges, what pilots know/dont know about industrial relations issues, what they want to know, and what it is that pilots from every background expect and need in an employee advocacy group. A mentoring program through the pilots advocacy group for new CPl's.
Lets face it, the current union structure has little relevency to the average GA pilot, I would hazard a guess that most CPL's have never even heard of their union. What they can & cant do, nor will any union ever really be in a position to bargain on behalf of the myriad of GA pilots living in outback NT, QLD, & WA.
For example Loss of license insurance, every pilot should have it right? I would hazard a guess that most new cpl's dont even know its available. And then if they did, they would probably have trouble justifying $847 + union fees, when they dont even get paid to fly jumpers. But then on the other hand, current loss of license insurance for a VB captain is probably too low and may not meet their needs.
Lets face it the way pilots fought industrial battles in 1966 is living in the past! Lets learn the lessons of history, look to the future, determine a strategy that takes account of the pilot group's strengths, weaknesses, threats & opportunities. Lets be smart, educate every pilot in the country with factual knowledge, so they can make informed decisions about their future.
I would love to see educational, informative information letting me know:
How the system works?
Why the system works the way it does? eg historical precedences
What has happened in the past when various options were taken
What options in the future are most likely to work/not work;
What strategic direction and what tactics the pilot group is going to use to achieve the best possible outcome for its constituents.
At the end of the day the company has the upper hand, no matter what the pilots do because the company has thousands of income sources, while most employee's have only the one.
Another reason is that empirically management pilots often start out in the pilot council's/union rep getting the background & experience to do the company job more effectively utilising the experience they gained as a union rep.
The Company has better resources, legal expertise, the public on their side and the longer they can drag out an EBA out the more they save in unpaid entitlements.
Im not here to bag anyone- everyone has a job to do and a role to play, but the pilot group (whichever pilot group you work for) is consistently outmaneouvered and outgunned (IMHO anyway).
Personally I would like to see indepth consultation with the entire industry, for example a large scale survey's of pilot T&C's, experience, problems, challenges, what pilots know/dont know about industrial relations issues, what they want to know, and what it is that pilots from every background expect and need in an employee advocacy group. A mentoring program through the pilots advocacy group for new CPl's.
Lets face it, the current union structure has little relevency to the average GA pilot, I would hazard a guess that most CPL's have never even heard of their union. What they can & cant do, nor will any union ever really be in a position to bargain on behalf of the myriad of GA pilots living in outback NT, QLD, & WA.
For example Loss of license insurance, every pilot should have it right? I would hazard a guess that most new cpl's dont even know its available. And then if they did, they would probably have trouble justifying $847 + union fees, when they dont even get paid to fly jumpers. But then on the other hand, current loss of license insurance for a VB captain is probably too low and may not meet their needs.
Lets face it the way pilots fought industrial battles in 1966 is living in the past! Lets learn the lessons of history, look to the future, determine a strategy that takes account of the pilot group's strengths, weaknesses, threats & opportunities. Lets be smart, educate every pilot in the country with factual knowledge, so they can make informed decisions about their future.
