Multi Job
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Don't know but if you still have ties with your training organizations, most have contacts with muti jobs.
The flight school that i attend has a deal with the local meat bombers. Giving us the first pick before lookinga t others.
Don't know if flying meat bombers have many hours but it is a start for a few years.
Most jobs now require 1500 muti hours but one of the biggest Austrlaia airlines, only require 500 hours PIC, no mention about multi.
The flight school that i attend has a deal with the local meat bombers. Giving us the first pick before lookinga t others.
Don't know if flying meat bombers have many hours but it is a start for a few years.
Most jobs now require 1500 muti hours but one of the biggest Austrlaia airlines, only require 500 hours PIC, no mention about multi.
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one of the biggest Austrlaia airlines, only require 500 hours PIC, no mention about multi.
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Most jobs now require 1500 muti hours but one of the biggest Austrlaia airlines, only require 500 hours PIC, no mention about multi
Here Here....the sooner the ridiculous requirement for 500hrs multi PIC disappears the better
Although I now have it
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This 500 multi PIC requirement is ridiculous, I gather this is some Australian ATPL requirement? You guys really need to get with the program, and the rest of the ICAO world. How does multi PIC time in a lightly have any bearing on one's ability to command a heavy aircraft? Surely co-pilot time and command practice (ICUS) on the relevant category of equipment is more relevant than light aircraft time. I assume you are all lobbying CASA to get this archaic requirement changed?
I'm also sick of people getting on their high horse about pilots just using GA as a stepping stone. There's a very good reason for that - it is! (with a few exceptions). I'm not saying there's any excuse not to give 100% in a GA job, and the type of people who will successfully move on will be doing just that. It is naive and stupid of a GA operator not to accept this simple fact. It is much better to expect very hard work from an employee for a short time than to try and keep them against their will for the long haul - you will just end up p!ssing everyone off. Often the one's jumping on this bandwagon are those who were unsuccessful in progressing beyond GA themselves.
I'm also sick of people getting on their high horse about pilots just using GA as a stepping stone. There's a very good reason for that - it is! (with a few exceptions). I'm not saying there's any excuse not to give 100% in a GA job, and the type of people who will successfully move on will be doing just that. It is naive and stupid of a GA operator not to accept this simple fact. It is much better to expect very hard work from an employee for a short time than to try and keep them against their will for the long haul - you will just end up p!ssing everyone off. Often the one's jumping on this bandwagon are those who were unsuccessful in progressing beyond GA themselves.
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Reality
Cloud Clutter,
It is not a requirement for the CASA/Australian ATPL.
Unfortunately though, you'll find that in Aussieland you really need that 500 M/E command to go anywhere/do anything, unless you just want to fly S/E or M/E piston GA rigs for the rest of your life.
Most regionals require it. I think it has a lot to do with insurance requirements more than the actual experience and how it may help you fly a heavy jet.
Indeed, GA is a stepping stone for many, and that's where it stems from. To get into Cathay as a DEFO, for example, there is a requirement for some multi turbine command time. To get a turbine command job here, it is usually RPT which means you need 500 multi command.
If it isn't RPT, they probably want jet time anyway.
Even as a DESO you are looked at with preference if you have multi engine command experience, according to their website.
I think that's about the reality of it, out here.
520.
It is not a requirement for the CASA/Australian ATPL.
Unfortunately though, you'll find that in Aussieland you really need that 500 M/E command to go anywhere/do anything, unless you just want to fly S/E or M/E piston GA rigs for the rest of your life.
Most regionals require it. I think it has a lot to do with insurance requirements more than the actual experience and how it may help you fly a heavy jet.
Indeed, GA is a stepping stone for many, and that's where it stems from. To get into Cathay as a DEFO, for example, there is a requirement for some multi turbine command time. To get a turbine command job here, it is usually RPT which means you need 500 multi command.
If it isn't RPT, they probably want jet time anyway.
Even as a DESO you are looked at with preference if you have multi engine command experience, according to their website.
I think that's about the reality of it, out here.
520.
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Ok, thanks for clearing that up. So why are the Australian insurance requirements so different from ours? Here you could walk into a turboprop scheduled airline (RPT) job with 100 hours total multi. The insurance requirement is more to do with the Captain, a typical FO insurance requirement is 1000 or 1500 hours total and stipulates nothing about the makeup of time.
Frankly I just don't think our countries are that different and it seems like you guys are getting a raw deal. I would guess that less than 20% of new hires into our entry-level airlines in the past 2 years would have had 500 hours multi command.
Does it not strike the airlines in Aus (and CASA) as a bit odd that so many of your countrymen are opting to move east for their first airline job rather than slave away working for this arbitrary requirement set by some bureaucrat, only to have to shell out for a type rating? I think you have every right to be p!ssed off!
Frankly I just don't think our countries are that different and it seems like you guys are getting a raw deal. I would guess that less than 20% of new hires into our entry-level airlines in the past 2 years would have had 500 hours multi command.
Does it not strike the airlines in Aus (and CASA) as a bit odd that so many of your countrymen are opting to move east for their first airline job rather than slave away working for this arbitrary requirement set by some bureaucrat, only to have to shell out for a type rating? I think you have every right to be p!ssed off!
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Cloud Cutter is right, if you believe anything you read on Cathays website you won't ever bother putting in applications..they are so desperate for pilots, they have started advertising in local magazines (unprecidented) 500 MEIR command is just like 1000TT or 300 Multi..just a way of getting rid of the average desperado pilot, so Mr recruitment can get on with his paperwork.
Keep trying..call people and send updates..everyone who thinks he/she MUST become a pro pilot eventually does
Keep trying..call people and send updates..everyone who thinks he/she MUST become a pro pilot eventually does
mattyj
I'm not sure what advertising you are talking about but let me tell you that your application won't be looked at unless you have 1000 TT and a command IF rating. At present you won't generally get an interview without 3000 TT and 1000 turbine. We have 20000 applications on file. Admittedly most of these aren't competative but we aren't short of qualified applicants. These are the facts from someone very close to the coal face.
I'm not sure what advertising you are talking about but let me tell you that your application won't be looked at unless you have 1000 TT and a command IF rating. At present you won't generally get an interview without 3000 TT and 1000 turbine. We have 20000 applications on file. Admittedly most of these aren't competative but we aren't short of qualified applicants. These are the facts from someone very close to the coal face.
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Still looking! I'll even fly singles for a while if there is a chance of progression!
1250 hours , MECIR , dangerous goods....
PM me if anyone knows of anything going
O&G
1250 hours , MECIR , dangerous goods....
PM me if anyone knows of anything going
O&G
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Mate just take any job you can get, regarless if its twin or not... not being disrespectful but 1200 hous is still low time especially if you dont have multi, just get any job then use the in-job contacts. I really wish you luck but dont knock back anything that you may be offered. I really wish the bst for you! ^^
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Hi O and G
I know where there is a multi/single job atm, but unfortunately i dont think your approach would suit the organistion?
"I'll even fly singles for a while if there is a chance of progression!"
You my only be kidding but it wont get you far.
Bulla.
I know where there is a multi/single job atm, but unfortunately i dont think your approach would suit the organistion?
"I'll even fly singles for a while if there is a chance of progression!"
You my only be kidding but it wont get you far.
Bulla.
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Tell me where and I'll be there!!!!!
Well guys I have just over 1000TT with MECIR and keen for any work that is going either in NZ or AUST or anywhere else in the world for that matter. Flown in the wet and dry seasons up north, and am currently looking in NZ but no luck so far. Will be heading over to northern WA for the dry season in the next couple of weeks, but if there is anyone out there with any info on any jobs going anywhere then feel free to PM me as I am dead keen to fly......anything!!!
Thanks to anyone in advance
Thanks to anyone in advance
This topic has been done to death round here, however for the record 500 Multi Engine require is a CAO requirement!! You need 500 ME Command on IFR flight plans for a command of >5700kg and 400 ME Command for Multi Crew
<5700 kg. You can count ICUS time towards this too if you can find someone willing enough to give you 500 ME ICUS!!
If you fly charter you only need 50 hours ME command for >5700kg.
Whilst it is a stupid requirement it does stop our pilot market from being flooded with europeans as they will have a hard time getting the experience to even apply to alot of airlines down here. Read on pprune where a NZ guy said he got a job in Europe in a regional with 250 hours TOTAL!!!! As he is only logging co pilot he wouldn't even be on the starting blocks for a regional job in this country.
Will be interesting though when they eventually retire all the piston twins though !!
For those wanting to look up the references check out CAO 82.3 Appendix 4 but note that is only for operations OTHER than High Cap RPT. So really Virgin, Jetstar and QF don't require it but everybody else does.
<5700 kg. You can count ICUS time towards this too if you can find someone willing enough to give you 500 ME ICUS!!
If you fly charter you only need 50 hours ME command for >5700kg.
Whilst it is a stupid requirement it does stop our pilot market from being flooded with europeans as they will have a hard time getting the experience to even apply to alot of airlines down here. Read on pprune where a NZ guy said he got a job in Europe in a regional with 250 hours TOTAL!!!! As he is only logging co pilot he wouldn't even be on the starting blocks for a regional job in this country.
Will be interesting though when they eventually retire all the piston twins though !!
For those wanting to look up the references check out CAO 82.3 Appendix 4 but note that is only for operations OTHER than High Cap RPT. So really Virgin, Jetstar and QF don't require it but everybody else does.
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Cloud cutter
Why dont you set up a charter company, and then you can provide lots of free training for all the newbies, and pay the high insurance premiums that go with all that.
Most of them will not make it into an airline, but many will think that your operation is only a "stepping stone"
.
Let's look at the facts. The accident records show conclusively that safety figures are MJCH MUCH better for pilots with 5000 hours or more. Not hundreds-Thousands. And it has been this way for decades. The figures are available from ATSB, and elsewhere, and show the definite, indisputable change.
The airlines know this, and you will not find many low time Boeing Captains.(except maybe in the military)
GA organisations like the RFDS look for THOUSANDS of hours when they are recruiting. Many of their pilots have 10,000 hours.
But GA has a flood of newbies, and some of them are very good. They are all apprentices, even though they have licences.. Some are quite arrogant, and Treat GA as "a stepping stone" or something unimportant.
We have areas in Australia, bigger than NZ where there is not a single doctor, dentist, electrician, or plumber. Some are 700 km from the nearest hospital. Go and live out there for a while, and then tell me that GA is "just a stepping stone."
GA in Australia is a VERY essential passenger and freight carrying service and must be treated seriously. The GA accident rate is too high, because there are very few experienced pilots. And too many people consider GA to be "JUST A STEPPING STONE" If you think that-do not come.
Most of them will not make it into an airline, but many will think that your operation is only a "stepping stone"
.
Let's look at the facts. The accident records show conclusively that safety figures are MJCH MUCH better for pilots with 5000 hours or more. Not hundreds-Thousands. And it has been this way for decades. The figures are available from ATSB, and elsewhere, and show the definite, indisputable change.
The airlines know this, and you will not find many low time Boeing Captains.(except maybe in the military)
GA organisations like the RFDS look for THOUSANDS of hours when they are recruiting. Many of their pilots have 10,000 hours.
But GA has a flood of newbies, and some of them are very good. They are all apprentices, even though they have licences.. Some are quite arrogant, and Treat GA as "a stepping stone" or something unimportant.
We have areas in Australia, bigger than NZ where there is not a single doctor, dentist, electrician, or plumber. Some are 700 km from the nearest hospital. Go and live out there for a while, and then tell me that GA is "just a stepping stone."
GA in Australia is a VERY essential passenger and freight carrying service and must be treated seriously. The GA accident rate is too high, because there are very few experienced pilots. And too many people consider GA to be "JUST A STEPPING STONE" If you think that-do not come.
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Originally Posted by bullamakanka
Hi O and G
I know where there is a multi/single job atm, but unfortunately i dont think your approach would suit the organistion?
"I'll even fly singles for a while if there is a chance of progression!"
You my only be kidding but it wont get you far.
Bulla.
I know where there is a multi/single job atm, but unfortunately i dont think your approach would suit the organistion?
"I'll even fly singles for a while if there is a chance of progression!"
You my only be kidding but it wont get you far.
Bulla.
I think you misunderstood what I meant.
I'm more than happy to fly singles for ages in an organisation which has twins so I can move on up later on.
Bushy - As previously posted your interpretation of the facts is needs some looking at! Any raw statistics taken from the ATSB are totaly meaningless if you do not consider-
Relative to the total number of pilots, those that have in excess of 5000 hours (the MAGIC number ?!?!?!?!?!) would be relatively small. I am guessing but something in the order of 10% of active pilots seems likely - SO OF COURSE THEY WILL HAVE FAR FAR LESS ACCIDENTS - there are far far less of them for a start.
In addition the vast bulk of those pilots would be operating in equipment (turboprop, turbojet) that has redundancy and safety technology that light aircraft just don't have. Also they would tend to operate for organizations that have a far more extensive support network.
The pilot in command of the Lockhart River accident had a little in excess of 6000 hours - the worst accident for 40 odd years and one that will likely be attributed to have a significant pilot error factor. It would be probable as well to assume that the crew of the fatal RFDS accident at Mt. Gambier also had well in excess of your magic number as did the famous Bangkok golfers. Hours alone gurantee nothing and to rely on someones total flying hours as a safety indicator is high folly.
I am not saying that experience is not a significant determinant in risk, but that to say you are bullet proof once you have so many hours is ridiculous.
Maybe the statement below will get you thinking about what I am trying to say.
"No blind pilot in Australia has ever had an accident. They have a 100% safety record!"
Relative to the total number of pilots, those that have in excess of 5000 hours (the MAGIC number ?!?!?!?!?!) would be relatively small. I am guessing but something in the order of 10% of active pilots seems likely - SO OF COURSE THEY WILL HAVE FAR FAR LESS ACCIDENTS - there are far far less of them for a start.
In addition the vast bulk of those pilots would be operating in equipment (turboprop, turbojet) that has redundancy and safety technology that light aircraft just don't have. Also they would tend to operate for organizations that have a far more extensive support network.
The pilot in command of the Lockhart River accident had a little in excess of 6000 hours - the worst accident for 40 odd years and one that will likely be attributed to have a significant pilot error factor. It would be probable as well to assume that the crew of the fatal RFDS accident at Mt. Gambier also had well in excess of your magic number as did the famous Bangkok golfers. Hours alone gurantee nothing and to rely on someones total flying hours as a safety indicator is high folly.
I am not saying that experience is not a significant determinant in risk, but that to say you are bullet proof once you have so many hours is ridiculous.
Maybe the statement below will get you thinking about what I am trying to say.
"No blind pilot in Australia has ever had an accident. They have a 100% safety record!"
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Blind pilots
There are some blind ones posting on here.
Look at the figures yourself. They are expressed as a figure PER 100,000 flying hours,
No-one said anyone was bullet proof, but it is a proven fact that low time pilots have a much higher accident rate than more experienced ones. Face facts.
Look at the figures yourself. They are expressed as a figure PER 100,000 flying hours,
No-one said anyone was bullet proof, but it is a proven fact that low time pilots have a much higher accident rate than more experienced ones. Face facts.