Mt Cook Airlink
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Line Operations Safety Audit (LOSA)
http://www.siaa.asn.au/simtect/2005/LOSA_AC_Draft.pdf
http://www.siaa.asn.au/simtect/2005/LOSA_AC_Draft.pdf
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Just wondering where you pulled 1800hrs from Cloud?
Also, they have interviewed some who don't have all ATPL's but you will not get a start until you've got 'em all. Probably wont get an interview with less than 4+ though. As for other criteria, probably best to PM Stillalbatross!
Con, I'm sure the guys doing a good job will welcome that. That's the trouble with wide nets, a similar comment about eyes opening or raised eyebrows could be made about isolated incidents seen of Nelson, Eagle, Origin and jets, both blue and red tailed! Wouldn't condemn the company or all their pilots based on that.
Also, they have interviewed some who don't have all ATPL's but you will not get a start until you've got 'em all. Probably wont get an interview with less than 4+ though. As for other criteria, probably best to PM Stillalbatross!
Con, I'm sure the guys doing a good job will welcome that. That's the trouble with wide nets, a similar comment about eyes opening or raised eyebrows could be made about isolated incidents seen of Nelson, Eagle, Origin and jets, both blue and red tailed! Wouldn't condemn the company or all their pilots based on that.
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Cheers,
Never ceased to be amazed by arbitrary "minimum" hourly requirements. Would 1780 hours be enough? Before the attacks start, yes I agree there needs to be some kind of base experience. Oh well, as Mr Gann said, it's always about the numbers!
Suppose it stems from the CAA 200 hour CPL stance. I believe a more realistic number is 146 hours or 217 hours or 456 hours, all depends on the chap/chapette involved. Does Massey still have that nonsense 150 hour CPL dispensation? Such intensive high quality training!
Never ceased to be amazed by arbitrary "minimum" hourly requirements. Would 1780 hours be enough? Before the attacks start, yes I agree there needs to be some kind of base experience. Oh well, as Mr Gann said, it's always about the numbers!
Suppose it stems from the CAA 200 hour CPL stance. I believe a more realistic number is 146 hours or 217 hours or 456 hours, all depends on the chap/chapette involved. Does Massey still have that nonsense 150 hour CPL dispensation? Such intensive high quality training!
Join Date: Feb 2004
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No, I think it stems from the limited file cabinet size. The system Air NZ use is better at judging the suitability of applicants, I certainly agree that flight time is just one of many factors that make a pilot employable. There are always some low time pilots who would be far more suitable for a role than some high time pilots.
Just as the 200 (or 150) hours is minimum for a CPL, many people do not meat the standard untill they have more experience and training, but it would also be reasonable to say that someone who does meat the standard with less time, still does not have enough experience, that is why there are minimums.
Unfortunately the up-keep on a recruitement system like big bro's makes it a bit out of the grasp of a small regional airline.
Just as the 200 (or 150) hours is minimum for a CPL, many people do not meat the standard untill they have more experience and training, but it would also be reasonable to say that someone who does meat the standard with less time, still does not have enough experience, that is why there are minimums.
Unfortunately the up-keep on a recruitement system like big bro's makes it a bit out of the grasp of a small regional airline.
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You can say what you want but it is unbelievable that an outfit like Cook could interview people and after putting them through the ringer find some applicants suitable. Then send them a letter telling them that they have been successful and that they would be on the next intake and then completely forget they had successful applicants waiting and instead recruit again.
I wasn't on the receiving end of this BS but I had some mates who were. There must be more than a couple of dozen people floating around on worthless "yes" letters from Mount Cook and if you changed jobs in the meantime Cook would get upset with you and refuse to return your calls.
If you think as a pilot in NZ you deserve this kind of treatment then you're just what the industry needs at the moment. Why don't you offer to pay for the ATR type rating as well?
It would be nice if Cook took less of a GA mickey mouse approach to it all.
I wasn't on the receiving end of this BS but I had some mates who were. There must be more than a couple of dozen people floating around on worthless "yes" letters from Mount Cook and if you changed jobs in the meantime Cook would get upset with you and refuse to return your calls.
If you think as a pilot in NZ you deserve this kind of treatment then you're just what the industry needs at the moment. Why don't you offer to pay for the ATR type rating as well?
It would be nice if Cook took less of a GA mickey mouse approach to it all.
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Stillalbatross,
How far in the past are you talking here mate, days of Glacier flying and 'The Bomber' I suspect given your 1st post. I can only re-iterate to those with Interviews that things HAVE changed from the 70's and the recruitment process is not "mickey mouse".
Where the hell do you get off insinuating that people think that? In amongst the genuine posts in this tread I didn't see the one about how we like seeing our fellow Pilots getting f@ck3d over! 
Rant complete. Good luck for those with interviews coming up
I wasn't on the receiving end of this BS but I had some mates who were. There must be more than a couple of dozen people floating
around on worthless "yes" letters from Mount Cook
around on worthless "yes" letters from Mount Cook
If you think as a pilot in NZ you deserve this kind of treatment then you're just what the industry needs at the moment. Why don't you offer to pay for the ATR type rating as well?
Rant complete. Good luck for those with interviews coming up
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Line Operations Safety Audit, or words to that effect, sorta.
Some chap sits there watching every time you make a wee faux pas. Like not referring to the approach chart when arriving, not each having a chart, not checking the terrain each time you're over it etc, etc.......
Blah, Blah, things you do every day but according to some grand scale aren't a perfect (or pristine) flight.
Some chap sits there watching every time you make a wee faux pas. Like not referring to the approach chart when arriving, not each having a chart, not checking the terrain each time you're over it etc, etc.......
Blah, Blah, things you do every day but according to some grand scale aren't a perfect (or pristine) flight.
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Kmang,
I too hope that anyone who puts in the effort and gets through the interview and gets offered employment ACTUALLY gets a job to go to and not a worthless piece of paper merely proclaiming it.
Maybe the nice folks running cook could pick up a copy of flight international and discover 1) that they aren't the only ATR operators on the planet and 2) that their exhaulted position in the scheme of things isn't actually slightly above NASA.
And no the cook "glorified GA" approach to recruitment I refer to wasn't in the 1970's, in fact it was less than 10 years ago................
I too hope that anyone who puts in the effort and gets through the interview and gets offered employment ACTUALLY gets a job to go to and not a worthless piece of paper merely proclaiming it.
Maybe the nice folks running cook could pick up a copy of flight international and discover 1) that they aren't the only ATR operators on the planet and 2) that their exhaulted position in the scheme of things isn't actually slightly above NASA.
And no the cook "glorified GA" approach to recruitment I refer to wasn't in the 1970's, in fact it was less than 10 years ago................
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Less than 10 years ago, so 9 and a half years ago then. I believe some of the guys who do the recruitment now have only been there for around 4 years. I'm guessing things in your life are rather stagnant if you expect that nothing changes in a decade. Unfortunately it seems you've got that great kiwi disease of running down your fellow chum(s) based on historical information. The same things could be said about Air New Zealand itself up until recent times with the upturn in employment. I don't know of anyone who's received the shaftings you allude to RECENTLY. Actually do a bit of research and get your facts right about the current situation and get over your past bitterness. Nasa-haven't got Cook mixed up with Eagle do you?!!
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So lets see if I have this right ;
It didn't actually happen to you....
It happened about 10 years ago....
The recruitment team remains unchanged since then....
The recruitment team sends everyone 'yes' letters to not hurt anyones feelings but only calls the people it really wants...
Cook believes it is up there with NASA due to the highly competitive GA Mickey Mouse recruitment process... or was it due to being the only ATR operator in NZ...or because we are such snappy dressers....or because you didn't get in (sorry, forgot, it was a 'friend of yours')
Is anyone else out there REALLY scared at how vindictive Stillalbatross would be if this had actually happened to him??
It didn't actually happen to you....
It happened about 10 years ago....
The recruitment team remains unchanged since then....
The recruitment team sends everyone 'yes' letters to not hurt anyones feelings but only calls the people it really wants...
Cook believes it is up there with NASA due to the highly competitive GA Mickey Mouse recruitment process... or was it due to being the only ATR operator in NZ...or because we are such snappy dressers....or because you didn't get in (sorry, forgot, it was a 'friend of yours')
Is anyone else out there REALLY scared at how vindictive Stillalbatross would be if this had actually happened to him??
No not really.
Actually its kinda nice to see someone other than the EagleBoys getting some sh@t flung at them (although funny that the first response was to deflect crap in that direction!!)
Surely this is all tongue in cheek, people aren't going to lay down their life cause someone touched a nerve? Have a laugh for once.
Actually its kinda nice to see someone other than the EagleBoys getting some sh@t flung at them (although funny that the first response was to deflect crap in that direction!!)
Surely this is all tongue in cheek, people aren't going to lay down their life cause someone touched a nerve? Have a laugh for once.
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Kmagyoyo,
In what normal parallel universe is it common practice to send out acceptance letters to a bunch of people you have just interviewed that you have no intention of hiring so you don't hurt their feelings.............
If the cook recruiters can't cope with recruiting then maybe they shouldn't be doing it.
Kmagyoyo, there is obviously no limit to how low you would stoop or how quickly you would bend over and take whatever cook dished out as part of the recruitment process, and no doubt plenty of GA employers welcome you with open arms.
As I first mentioned, the crap cook used to put people through wouldn't be acceptable in any other subsidiary of any other large company in any other profession anywhere else in the world.
Why you insist on defending their methods is beyond me. I only hope they have changed, they hadn't changed in the 30 years previous and they were still a joke in '99.
In what normal parallel universe is it common practice to send out acceptance letters to a bunch of people you have just interviewed that you have no intention of hiring so you don't hurt their feelings.............
If the cook recruiters can't cope with recruiting then maybe they shouldn't be doing it.
Kmagyoyo, there is obviously no limit to how low you would stoop or how quickly you would bend over and take whatever cook dished out as part of the recruitment process, and no doubt plenty of GA employers welcome you with open arms.
As I first mentioned, the crap cook used to put people through wouldn't be acceptable in any other subsidiary of any other large company in any other profession anywhere else in the world.
Why you insist on defending their methods is beyond me. I only hope they have changed, they hadn't changed in the 30 years previous and they were still a joke in '99.
H
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I am with you Nike, this is freaking hilairous!
A one day selection process (which didn't involve any outward homosexual behaviour) followed by a yes letter the following week and then a start date a couple of months later isn't particularly arduous in my book and I dont feel I somehow prostituted myself completing it.
Stillalbatross, can we keep personal attacks out of this please, sheeze you ever heard of scarcasm? For the record I have never worked or flown for free...although OCDT salary isn't far off. As Capt on Heat and myself keep saying ad neaus the selection process has changed from what you say used to happen. And I am glad it did! End of story.
I have wasted enough of my day off with this crap...later!
A one day selection process (which didn't involve any outward homosexual behaviour) followed by a yes letter the following week and then a start date a couple of months later isn't particularly arduous in my book and I dont feel I somehow prostituted myself completing it.
Stillalbatross, can we keep personal attacks out of this please, sheeze you ever heard of scarcasm? For the record I have never worked or flown for free...although OCDT salary isn't far off. As Capt on Heat and myself keep saying ad neaus the selection process has changed from what you say used to happen. And I am glad it did! End of story.
I have wasted enough of my day off with this crap...later!
Last edited by kmagyoyo; 5th Nov 2005 at 20:07.
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Off the topic but does Air Nelson still want '50' hours recent NZ IFR time before they'll interview you? ie, pilots who were fortunate enough to get experience outside NZ need not apply?
Shags
Shags
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Shags... i believe air nelson ask for the 50 hrs NZ IF so that they can use it as a way to discriminate if they want, but the truth to the matter is NO it didn't stop me.