Video Mixdown

Nothing is a panacea, but MiG 29 is presumably a diminishing resource because the aircraft is quickly fading from use by East European operators in favour of Western types. It also fits with a Ukrainian desire to move in the same direction politically, economically, culturally and militarily - arguably the main reason Putin launched his SMO in the first place.

NutLoose

One will be radar range, something Ukraine is lacking against the equivalent Russian aircraft and a lot more weapons fit, true they have adapted some weapons to work but some of them are apparently jury rigged so have the minimum operational control over the weapons.
The F-16 gives you all of that and more.

Beamr

Zelenskyy currently inspecting the to be Ukrainian fast jets.

jolihokistix

It’s taken time for the support to collect, and there’s much more to come, but piece by piece, step by step, Ukraine is growing in strength and pushing Russian forces back off stolen land. Russia’s losses are horrific, and she needs breathing space. Natural that she would put out peace feelers to try and hold on to something at least.

ORAC

Reference weapons for the F-16,

As previously noted the RAF sent a team to Israel to examine the Rampage missile.

The speculation was that is was as a replacement for Storm Shadow, but that is unlikely for several reasons including that the Storm Shadow has greater range, a fr better warhead and the RAF is planning to replace it with Spear which is F-35 compatible.

However the RAF is supplying Storm Shadow to Ukraine but has dwindling numbers to pass on - but Rampage is designed to be fired by the F-16 which can carry 4 at a time….

https://geopolitiki.com/rampage-miss...raeli-missile/

Video Mixdown

It's been said many times, but no agreement, pact or treaty with Putin's regime is worth the paper it's written on. Breathing space would merely give him time to regroup before trying again. As far as Russia is concerned, kick them while they're down is the only safe option.

T28B

A quick note as regards thread drift:
@munnst has alertly noted that the conversation began to derail again into politics, and so moved his points to the JB thread (where such belongs) by posting on that political topic there.
Discussions on the negotiations between the warring parties, or other parties, and the hopes of them bearing any fruit, belong there.
The discussion of arms and arms shipments certainly fit here, and of course that will be tainted somewhat by politics.
Please do your best to police yourselves, as @munnst has done.
As your desire to comment drifts further toward the political, please make those comments in that thread (by all means, a link to the post here which evoked your comment is very fitting) where numerous interesting points and perspectives continue to be offered.

Thank you all in advance.

GeeRam

If these are real photos from the airfield after the attack, I'd say that Tu-22M would be classified as 'damaged'

Chu Chu

And the small arms hit on the drone may have been somewhat less effective.

Uberteknik

Weapons supply capability increased dramatically, pilots situational awareness improves dramatically, weapons fully integrated not jury-rigged, better radar in high clutter and jamming environments, communications links, EW capability plus 4600 produced since production commenced. Multiple countries can service so the support base is second to none. Load out comprising combinations of:

• Guns: 1 × 20 mm (0.787 in) M61A1 Vulcan 6-barrel rotary cannon, 511 rounds
• Hardpoints: 2 × wing-tip air-to-air missile launch rails, 6 × under-wing, and 3 × under-fuselage pylon (2 of 3 for sensors) stations with a capacity of up to 17,000 lb (7,700 kg) of stores
• Rockets:
  • 4 × LAU-61/LAU-68 rocket pods (each with 19/7 × Hydra 70 mm/APKWS[264] rockets, respectively)
  • 4 × LAU-5003 rocket pods (each with 19 × CRV7 70 mm rockets)
  • 4 × LAU-10 rocket pods (each with 4 × Zuni 127 mm rockets)
• Missiles:
  • Air-to-air missiles:
    • 6 × AIM-9 Sidewinder
    • 6 × AIM-120 AMRAAM
    • 6 × IRIS-T
    • 6 × Python-4
    • 6 × Python-5
  • Air-to-surface missiles:
    • 6 × AGM-65 Maverick
    • 2 × AGM-88 HARM
    • AGM-158 JASSM (JASSM)
    • 4 × AGM-154 Joint Standoff Weapon (JSOW)
  • Anti-ship missiles:
    • 2 × AGM-84 Harpoon
    • 4 × AGM-119 Penguin
    • Joint Strike Missile (To be integrated)
• Bombs:
  • 8 × CBU-87 Combined Effects Munition
  • 8 × CBU-89 Gator mine
  • 8 × CBU-97 Sensor Fuzed Weapon
  • 4 × Mark 84 general-purpose bombs
  • 8 × Mark 83 GP bombs
  • 12 × Mark 82 GP bombs
  • 8 × GBU-39 Small Diameter Bomb (SDB)
  • 4 × GBU-10 Paveway II
  • 6 × GBU-12 Paveway II
  • 4 × GBU-24 Paveway III
  • 4 × GBU-27 Paveway III
  • 4 × Joint Direct Attack Munition (JDAM) series
  • Wind Corrected Munitions Dispenser (WCMD)
  • B61 nuclear bomb
  • B83 nuclear bomb
• Others:
  • SUU-42A/A flares/infrared decoys dispenser pod and chaff pod or
  • AN/ALQ-131 & AN/ALQ-184 ECM pods on centerline or
  • LANTIRN, Lockheed Martin Sniper XR & Litening targeting pods or
  • AN/ASQ-213 HARM targeting system (HTS) Pod (typically configured on station 5L with Sniper XR pod on station 5R) or
  • Up to 3 × 300/330/370/600 US gallon Sargent Fletcher drop tanks for ferry flight/extended range/loitering time or
  • UTC Aerospace DB-110 long range EO/IR sensor pod on centerline

Avionics

• AN/APG-68 radar, being replaced on US Air Force F-16C/D Block 40/42 and 50/52 by AN/APG-83 AESA radar[265][266]
• AN/ALR-56M radar warning receiver, being replaced on US Air Force F-16C/D Block 40/42 and 50/52 by AN/ALR-69A(V)
• AN/ALQ-213 electronic warfare suite, being replaced on US Air Force F-16C/D Block 40/42 and 50/52 by AN/ALQ-257
• MIL-STD-1553 bus[267]

Beamr

Danish ministry of defence has published an official statement regarding the donation of F16's to Unraine.

RedToo

Thank you for that list. Makes it pretty obvious why Ukraine wants the F16.

Beamr

Zelenskyy thanking the Netherlands for providing 42 F16's. However, the Dutch have only 24 of those. Is this 42 including Danish donations as well, or is the Netherlands buying extra 18 from somewhere to be donated?

Beamr

Denmark apparently providing 19. Together with the known Dutch F16's that would make roughly the announced 42.

DogTailRed2

How will F16's benefit Ukraine when they are fighting in a missile rich, not aircraft threat rich enviroment?

Uberteknik

OpSec dear chap. OpSec.

They will go after the missile launchers.First Line of Effort: Follow-on Forces Attack (FOFA) FOFA was designed to conventionally strike enemy combat formations stretching from just behind the frontline troops to deep into the adversary’s rear. The strategic intent is to reduce the enemy units into a “manageable ratio” before they reach the central defensive lines.

MGM-140 Army Tactical Missile Systems (ATACMS). The ATACMS would bring an unprecedented improvement to Ukraine’s long-range fire capacity, boosting the 50-miles effective range of HIMARS to 186 miles. High-precision offers a critical capability to keep attacking rocket and loitering munition launchers, large ammunition depots, and command and control (C2) nodes, as well as air contingents within the range.

Gray Eagle Drones. MQ-1C Gray Eagle comes with an advanced sensors suit and a potent weapons configuration, including AGM-114 Hellfire missiles. Being able to fly above the engagement envelopes of man-portable air defense systems (MANPADS) and having good airborne endurance (at least 27 hours for the mainstream variant, and up to 40 hours for the extended-range upgrade), the unmanned system can offer notable tactical flexibility to the Ukrainian Armed Forces.

F-16 Combat Aircraft. Comprehensive airpower MRCA capability. At present, Ukrainians are flying very low and for a brief period in each sortie to avoid Russian surface-to-air missile (SAM) systems and Russia’s better air-to-air capabilities. F-16 aircraft can carry AMRAAM beyond-visual-range air-to-air missiles can address Ukraine’s problem to a large extent. F-16s would also unlock all the advanced capabilities of the AGM-88 HARM anti-radiation missiles that were already transferred by the US. At present, the Ukrainian Air Force uses the AGM-88 missiles, with limited operational potential, on its Soviet-Russian Mig-29 aircraft.

Second Line of Effort: Augment Ukraine’s air and missile defense network. This objective is particularly important given the fact that the Russian military will keep launching Iran-made loitering munitions, and probably missiles, into Ukraine in larger numbers day by day.

Slowly, slowly, catchee, monkey.

Ninthace

I suppose that depends on how many missiles are launched from enemy ac, how many from ground based systems and how the F-16s are employed.

rixt

According Dutch newspapers the Dutch have 42 of which 24 operational and the Danish 19.

GeeRam

Dutch have more than 24.
They had agreed to sell Draken Int 12 with a followup buy option of further 28, but the deal seem to have fallen through back in June, and Draken are now only committed to buying 6 ex-Dutch AF F-16's which are the 6 that the Dutch had operated at their training base in USA, but are now back in Belgium being overhauled, so that leaves 36 ex-Dutch AF aircraft available, if you don't include the ones they are still flying in the last Dutch squadron flying them.... so there could easily be 42 ex-Dutch ones alone, plus the Danish ones.

Tartiflette Fan

Why can't they use HARM *for that - or HIMARS* if thery are close (up to 90 km ) to FEBA ? ( *missile launchers )

" HARM range of operation

• Low-level — 13 nmi (25 km)
• Medium-level — 43 nmi (80 km)
• Standoff — 80 nmi (148 km)
• AGM-88G — 160 nmi (300 km)"

EDIT: It seems that Ukraine has received HARM AGM_88G with 300 km range.

"The Ukrainian Air Force also adapted the American AGM-88 HARM air-to-surface anti-radiation missiles for use with Su-27 fighters. A corresponding photo appeared on social networks in September, 2022. Previously, it was known that these missiles were used only with Soviet-made Ukrainian MiG-29 jets."

https://www.globalsecurity.org/milit...20turned%20off.