Outing a Walt!
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Sorry for going off thread for a moments, but:
Ballast wrote:
"Based on the experience of my cadets he would have been lucky to get anything like the hours for a ppl through the scholarship. I seem to recall it is now funded to the point where an average stude would expect to solo (around 13 hours???)."
13 hours to solo? Is that right? If so, what kind of boys and girls are they accepting for Flying Scholarships these days? In my day, you had your ab initio solo on hour 7. If you weren't quite up to speed you had the 30min 'progress check' with the chief instructor and if you weren't up to spec by the end of that, you packed your bags.
Talk about a waste of money. Why not just cut the number of scholarhsips in half and put the money in providing a more comprehensive course for the ones that are retained? Actually, I know the answer, the PC brigade don't want the little 'uns to feel demoralised. Failure to solo on a course can be referred to as 'deferred success'.
Here's a point of information boys and girls that you'll have to get get used to: Not everyone gets to be an astronaut when they grow up.
Rant over.
Ballast wrote:
"Based on the experience of my cadets he would have been lucky to get anything like the hours for a ppl through the scholarship. I seem to recall it is now funded to the point where an average stude would expect to solo (around 13 hours???)."
13 hours to solo? Is that right? If so, what kind of boys and girls are they accepting for Flying Scholarships these days? In my day, you had your ab initio solo on hour 7. If you weren't quite up to speed you had the 30min 'progress check' with the chief instructor and if you weren't up to spec by the end of that, you packed your bags.
Talk about a waste of money. Why not just cut the number of scholarhsips in half and put the money in providing a more comprehensive course for the ones that are retained? Actually, I know the answer, the PC brigade don't want the little 'uns to feel demoralised. Failure to solo on a course can be referred to as 'deferred success'.
Here's a point of information boys and girls that you'll have to get get used to: Not everyone gets to be an astronaut when they grow up.
Rant over.
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If you weren't quite up to speed you had the 30min 'progress check' with the chief instructor and if you weren't up to spec by the end of that, you packed your bags
If a stude fails at anything the first person to be interviewed by the Boss is their instructor, whilst failing stude gets counselling on how the system let them down and it wasn't their fault. "There-there, mummy's ickle soldier, don't listen to the nasty man"
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13 hours to first solo seems about average in the civvie world these days. I wonder if flying schools are scared of being sued so leave first solo until they are quadruply sure the student is ready? After all with 45hrs required for the JAR PPL (32 for the NPPL) there are still plenty of hours to play with for nav &c.
Tim
Tim
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TR,
Excuse me borrowing part of your post
""There-there 907, mummy's ickle soldier, don't listen to the nasty man"
all spelling mistakes are "df" alcohol induced
Excuse me borrowing part of your post
""There-there 907, mummy's ickle soldier, don't listen to the nasty man"
all spelling mistakes are "df" alcohol induced
Last edited by Always_broken_in_wilts; 5th Oct 2005 at 21:55.
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In the days of the Chipmunk if you hadn't gone solo by 10 hours you had a mandatory change of instructor and went on 'Review',
that meant you had five hours to prove yourself and if you didn't, you were OUT.
The average fell between eight and twelve hours. As the SFI, (RAF Wing Commander), said, when he welcomed us, "The best pilots usually are the last to go solo".
that meant you had five hours to prove yourself and if you didn't, you were OUT.
The average fell between eight and twelve hours. As the SFI, (RAF Wing Commander), said, when he welcomed us, "The best pilots usually are the last to go solo".
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Is does sound a bit iffy!!
After OASC, I got 15 hrs Air League, 20 hrs ATC flying scholarship and the ACPNS (on the nav course my instructor had a caa inst rating, so all the hours counted!!) all I did was 5 hours on a 150 and finished my ppl at 17, all for less than 200 pictures of lizzy!
But the twin stuff..... How are they planning on keeping the rating going?
After OASC, I got 15 hrs Air League, 20 hrs ATC flying scholarship and the ACPNS (on the nav course my instructor had a caa inst rating, so all the hours counted!!) all I did was 5 hours on a 150 and finished my ppl at 17, all for less than 200 pictures of lizzy!
But the twin stuff..... How are they planning on keeping the rating going?
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PPL
I'm former RAF aircrew but have taught the civillian PPL syllabus.
13 hours is actually quite good, in my experience some students are safe at 6 or 7 hours (RAF Flying Scholarship etc), but most civillians (selected by ability to pay, rather than ability to fly of course), take up to 15 or even 20 hours.
That said, those late solo-ers often do better later in the course as they have mastered devillshly complex concepts such as Power Attitude and Trim more fully, and now have the capacity to look out of the window and nav.
Sorry, long way from bogus multi engine ratings aren't we.
Oh by the way the critical engine with counter rotating props is dependent upon cross wind....but I think you knew that.
Cheers,
MoT
13 hours is actually quite good, in my experience some students are safe at 6 or 7 hours (RAF Flying Scholarship etc), but most civillians (selected by ability to pay, rather than ability to fly of course), take up to 15 or even 20 hours.
That said, those late solo-ers often do better later in the course as they have mastered devillshly complex concepts such as Power Attitude and Trim more fully, and now have the capacity to look out of the window and nav.
Sorry, long way from bogus multi engine ratings aren't we.
Oh by the way the critical engine with counter rotating props is dependent upon cross wind....but I think you knew that.
Cheers,
MoT
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All sensible comments, especially the bit about the risk of litigation courtesy of Mr & Mrs Bloggs who have just received word that Bloggs Jnr has just redecorated a field with the remains of a C152 or Katana.
Still, you would have thought that they'd make greater use of OASC to sort the wheat from the chaff to bring the average time to solo down.
Just for comparison's sake, is there anyone out there who can tell me how long they allow for teaching a spacey how to drive a Vigilant around the circuit?
Still, you would have thought that they'd make greater use of OASC to sort the wheat from the chaff to bring the average time to solo down.
Just for comparison's sake, is there anyone out there who can tell me how long they allow for teaching a spacey how to drive a Vigilant around the circuit?
>Just for comparison's sake, is there anyone out there who can tell me how long they allow for teaching a spacey how to drive a Vigilant around the circuit?<
The Gliding Scholarship allows 8hr. Most seem to go in somewhere between 6 and 8 if they can manage reasonably regular attendance.
The Gliding Scholarship allows 8hr. Most seem to go in somewhere between 6 and 8 if they can manage reasonably regular attendance.
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Hrs to Solo (RAF/OASC)
Reviewing a few of the hoops that OASC have studes jump through on their way to a front seat, I wonder whether, given the degree of flying experience unofficially expected, that the assessment of coordination and mental ability could be done in a full motion simulator.
Most prospective jockeys will have already prepped through various means to arrive at a point where they should be able to deal with the exercise after a short intro.
Would this not give a better perpective of ability than the "stick and ring" approach.
Is the grassroots approach to Ab Initio training still the preferred entry point? I think not!
Comments ?
Most prospective jockeys will have already prepped through various means to arrive at a point where they should be able to deal with the exercise after a short intro.
Would this not give a better perpective of ability than the "stick and ring" approach.
Is the grassroots approach to Ab Initio training still the preferred entry point? I think not!
Comments ?
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Stax' profile
(So far)26 years man and boy in the RAF. Worked with Fast Jet, Slow Jet, Prop and Rotary in various places around the globe.
Dont forget to add "OUTER OF WALTS" to your resume,insert it infront of worked with fast jet if I were you....
(So far)26 years man and boy in the RAF. Worked with Fast Jet, Slow Jet, Prop and Rotary in various places around the globe.
Dont forget to add "OUTER OF WALTS" to your resume,insert it infront of worked with fast jet if I were you....
