FSTA delay?
All the MoD webiste (updated in Oct 2003) says is:
"Final bids were received from both consortia on 30 April 2003. Assessment of these bids is now underway. The PFI Service is expected to commence in 2008, leading to full service capability by 2012."
However, elsewhere a date of December 2003 for announcement of the preferred bidder is quoted.
Every time the programme slips to the right, the old BA 767-336s consume more flight cycles and airframe fatigue. Not a problem, of course, for the vastly more capable yet-to-be constructed A330-200 tanker-transports.
"Final bids were received from both consortia on 30 April 2003. Assessment of these bids is now underway. The PFI Service is expected to commence in 2008, leading to full service capability by 2012."
However, elsewhere a date of December 2003 for announcement of the preferred bidder is quoted.
Every time the programme slips to the right, the old BA 767-336s consume more flight cycles and airframe fatigue. Not a problem, of course, for the vastly more capable yet-to-be constructed A330-200 tanker-transports.
Not so, Stoppers old bean!
But at least both ac types have engines which actually work
A Monastery of Definance spokesman said:
"Yes please. Make it a large one - and not too much tonic. Now what was the question? FSTA? Err, yes. Pivotal in blue water thought and part of our overarching defence plans, underpinning our out of area commitments. Sort of a tank is it? No? A rifle then? Something which goes bang? Err...do you know about our Investment in People strategy? Or our Equal lack of Opportunites programme? Here you are, lots of glossy brochures - do take them with you. Must go now, old chap, people to meet, things to do - and the old glass is empty in case you haven't noticed......"
But at least both ac types have engines which actually work
A Monastery of Definance spokesman said:
"Yes please. Make it a large one - and not too much tonic. Now what was the question? FSTA? Err, yes. Pivotal in blue water thought and part of our overarching defence plans, underpinning our out of area commitments. Sort of a tank is it? No? A rifle then? Something which goes bang? Err...do you know about our Investment in People strategy? Or our Equal lack of Opportunites programme? Here you are, lots of glossy brochures - do take them with you. Must go now, old chap, people to meet, things to do - and the old glass is empty in case you haven't noticed......"
There are 2 bidders:
AirTanker www.airtanker.co.uk who are proposing new-build Airbus A330-200 aircraft with 111 tonnes of fuel.
TTSC www.ttsc.co.uk who are proposing ex-BA Boeing 767-336ER aircraft with 73.5 tonnes of fuel.
Decide for yourself- the website at www.mod.uk/dpa/projects/fsta.htm may be of some interest.
AirTanker www.airtanker.co.uk who are proposing new-build Airbus A330-200 aircraft with 111 tonnes of fuel.
TTSC www.ttsc.co.uk who are proposing ex-BA Boeing 767-336ER aircraft with 73.5 tonnes of fuel.
Decide for yourself- the website at www.mod.uk/dpa/projects/fsta.htm may be of some interest.
Inter Arma Enim Silentius Lex Legis
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Standby for this project to be cancelled, along with many others in the forthcoming round of serious defence cuts!!
See here
http://www.guardian.co.uk/guardianpo...073677,00.html
See here
http://www.guardian.co.uk/guardianpo...073677,00.html
Last edited by The Gorilla; 3rd Nov 2003 at 06:40.
2 points:
1. The A330 solution may involve some used ac - the B767s would certainly all be used ac.
2. The A310, whilst entirely capable, doesn't match the A330 in terms of ultimate capability.
1. The A330 solution may involve some used ac - the B767s would certainly all be used ac.
2. The A310, whilst entirely capable, doesn't match the A330 in terms of ultimate capability.
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Don't worry lads the solution is staring us in the face just have a look in theBeverly thread
Last edited by RoboAlbert; 4th Nov 2003 at 03:00.
Good to see the videoclip of the A330 proximity trial with a raspberry ripple Tornado on the AirTanker website - all seems nice and stable.....
But would it suit the bidder to take ac out of service to modify them into tankers whilst paying for new single role transport ac? I'd have thought it'd be better to have the older jets hauling grunts back and forth to the Great Sandtray to earn some dosh whilst having the tanker-transports built? They're going to need the 3rd seat, mission computer subsystem, pods, pumps, pipes and plumbing, centreline hose, military avionics etc fitted...
Plus I'm sure there must be some incentives for the 'launch customer'?
Plus I'm sure there must be some incentives for the 'launch customer'?
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Skoda noise generators for another 15 years!!
I am sure Mr BAe could support it...at a price!
Beags - make sure Airtankers bid is as attractive as TTSC, because in the current financial climate, the bottom line is all that our airships will be allowed to consider.
Airtankers bid is good, but it does not bail out an (ex) national carrier or line Marshalls pockets, that is probably its downfall.
I mean, we would not buy BA's cast offs would we? Oh wait a minute......
I am sure Mr BAe could support it...at a price!
Beags - make sure Airtankers bid is as attractive as TTSC, because in the current financial climate, the bottom line is all that our airships will be allowed to consider.
Airtankers bid is good, but it does not bail out an (ex) national carrier or line Marshalls pockets, that is probably its downfall.
I mean, we would not buy BA's cast offs would we? Oh wait a minute......
Sorry, chum - absolutely nothing to do with me!
Will the FSTA competition be won by the most capable and modern aircraft - or just someone else's cast-offs. As usual.
The RAF has never paid the 'real' price for AR aircraft; the Victors were ex-bombers as were the Valiants before them - and a few Vulcans even later. The Herc tanker was a modified ac for the Malvinas only; the VC10K2s were third hand, having passed through BOAC and then Gulf Air, the VC10K3s were re-possessed from East African, the TriStar Ks and VC10K4s are ba cast-offs....and the VC10C1Ks were modified after extensive use in the Air Transport role.
Now that the RAF is constantly deploying hither and thither in support of Trust-me Tone's bring-a-bottle wars, wouldn't it seem sensible to have something which for once hadn't first been used by someone else for 18 years...??
No - you're probably right. It'll be the cheaper option - which'll probably end up being the more expensive in the long run, no doubt. But that'll be for someone else to worry about, of course.
Like being given a pregnant cat for Christmas, some things look very appealing at first. It's only later you discover the consequences........
Will the FSTA competition be won by the most capable and modern aircraft - or just someone else's cast-offs. As usual.
The RAF has never paid the 'real' price for AR aircraft; the Victors were ex-bombers as were the Valiants before them - and a few Vulcans even later. The Herc tanker was a modified ac for the Malvinas only; the VC10K2s were third hand, having passed through BOAC and then Gulf Air, the VC10K3s were re-possessed from East African, the TriStar Ks and VC10K4s are ba cast-offs....and the VC10C1Ks were modified after extensive use in the Air Transport role.
Now that the RAF is constantly deploying hither and thither in support of Trust-me Tone's bring-a-bottle wars, wouldn't it seem sensible to have something which for once hadn't first been used by someone else for 18 years...??
No - you're probably right. It'll be the cheaper option - which'll probably end up being the more expensive in the long run, no doubt. But that'll be for someone else to worry about, of course.
Like being given a pregnant cat for Christmas, some things look very appealing at first. It's only later you discover the consequences........
