King’s Birthday Flypast

[Timelord]

Well done everybody involved in today’s flypast, even Clair Balding and especially the forecaster who predicted the clearance 15 minutes before the ToT and the commander who believed him or her. BZ.

[treadigraph]

Surprised to see three Chinooks belt over here just after 1pm, had forgotten the KBF was happening - must have been a near run thing with the weather as I got thoroughly soaked in SE London around 12.30 and could see much worse tracking NE further to the west. Thunder was quite audible!

[aw ditor]

Clare knows her horses'.

[BEagle]

Well done to all participants! The weather over Essex and East London must have been VERY demanding on the run-in, so the decision to conduct the flypast was very brave!

An unusual sight:

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/1000x640/goose_51_c88a89c0e9808e7a584df964cfe11b6e10c857be.jpg
Goose 51 + friends!

[Video Mixdown]

Well done to all participants! The weather over Essex and East London must have been VERY demanding on the run-in, so the decision to conduct the flypast was very brave!
Only minutes before the flypast was due there was a TV shot looking down the Mall through heavy rain towards cloud-shrouded buildings. I thought then that there was no chance it would go ahead. That it did, and they flew over the Palace in bright sunshine against blue skies seems almost miraculous.

[barotraumatized]

Only minutes before the flypast was due there was a TV shot looking down the Mall through heavy rain towards cloud-shrouded buildings. I thought then that there was no chance it would go ahead. That it did, and they flew over the Palace in bright sunshine against blue skies seems almost miraculous.

It’s a great demonstration of why, when Great British Public get uppity about things like Airshows being cancelled or certain ‘fly-in/fly-over’ participants not making it due weather, even if the sun is shining in said particular spot, it’s the ‘getting in and getting out’ that’s subject to the same (if not more- given the long ingress/amount of ground covered) weather risk/s.

[langleybaston]

Well done everybody involved in today’s flypast, even Clair Balding and especially the forecaster who predicted the clearance 15 minutes before the ToT and the commander who believed him or her. BZ.

Back in the day when there was still the London Weather Centre, once the date for the Birthday Parade was confirmed there was a scramble to book leave, or invoke other avoidances. Similarly for Armistice Sunday.

[Mr Grimsdale]

Great to see all the fast jets route over Beaconsfield on the way home.
Really appreciated!

[Easy Street]

https://x.com/ChiefofAirStaff/status/1802007003390214238?t=GsALMm8wQYCE3L1XTRH2TA&s=19

The London City METAR history (https://metar-taf.com/history/EGLC) shows the flypast to have been more or less into wind. So a close look at the photo linked above, looking back from the Chinook at the head of the flypast, shows how fine the margin must have been in the weather call. The shower which drenched earlier proceedings can be seen just off the flypast line behind the City skyscrapers. Had it been tracking a few hundred metres further northwest, or had the wind backed a few degrees more southerly, it would have scuppered the flypast: there'd have been no way of stepping around it so close to the Palace. Whoever was making the weather call on the ground would presumably have been watching the shower closely on rainfall radar as it tracked over Horse Guards and made the judgement that it would clear off the flypast line just in time. The METAR history shows that reports were being issued every 20mins in the run up to the flypast, with sketchy conditions reported at London City until 10 minutes to go, so they were obviously looking closely at that too. A courageous call rewarded with a glorious result. Well done indeed!

[BEagle]

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/1024x604/poseidon_72658c33dac5ec831f272b7130c4e9a93dfc81c6.jpg

Another unusual formation!

[treadigraph]

Croydon Airport area had a second soaking about an hour and a half after the flypast - torrential rain for a while and a near gale-force wind whipping around certainly at ground level. A proper squall. The three Chinooks I saw looked to have diverted south around that somewhere the other side of Guildford.

[Video Mixdown]

Another unusual formation!
Probably symbolic of the two types being co-located at Lossiemouth.

[Martin the Martian]

Probably symbolic of the two types being co-located at Lossiemouth.

Except that all the Typhoons were contributed by the Coningsby Wing.

Did the gap between elements seem longer this year, or was I imagining it?

[Video Mixdown]

Except that all the Typhoons were contributed by the Coningsby Wing.
Did the gap between elements seem longer this year, or was I imagining it?
It is just my guess, and I did say types, not actual aircraft. From the ground they all look the same, and logically you'd want to launch all the Typhoons from the same base.
Maybe they just gave the P-8 an escort so it didn't look as if Ryanair had blundered into the formation (joke!).

[Easy Street]

Except that all the Typhoons were contributed by the Coningsby Wing.

Did the gap between elements seem longer this year, or was I imagining it?

I remember there being fast jets in formation with Nimrods and transports in years gone by so I think it is more about providing interest and making it look like the RAF has made an effort than it is about symbolising any base or any relationship between the types. Also better than stretching out the flypast with lots of individual small formations.

As for the spacing, I doubt any of this year's participants knew what the spacing was last year, apart from the lead planner, whose first task was almost certainly taking last year's op order and changing the date :E There are previous years available to view in iPlayer and YouTube if you'd like to compare.

[wub]

I was surprised that some formations, including the Reds flew over Heathrow, necessitating commercial traffic to hold.

[treadigraph]

I was surprised that some formations, including the Reds flew over Heathrow, necessitating commercial traffic to hold.
It is always the case because the formations scatter almost under the 27R approach around Fulham. Gap of about 15 minutes in the approach yesterday (possibly not all that different from swapping ends from 27 to 09?).

[Deep Throat]

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/1024x604/poseidon_72658c33dac5ec831f272b7130c4e9a93dfc81c6.jpg

Another unusual formation!

Unusual in that FINALLY we have a Maritime role again!

Given what the Russians are up to these days, that is very good news

In 2010 it was 4 Tornados and the Nimrod R1

Only 3 helicopters this year

The UK forces are stretched to capacity

Is it time to consider a Coastguard element?

+ AAC and RN if we can spare them off task?

[GeeRam]

It is always the case because the formations scatter almost under the 27R approach around Fulham. Gap of about 15 minutes in the approach yesterday (possibly not all that different from swapping ends from 27 to 09?).

Only since the 100th Anniversary of the RAF flypast, which was routed over LHR, and ever since the Trooping one and any otehrs have followed suit.
Prior to that for many, many years only the helo's and BBMF would peel off pdq and helo's would turn south and follow the river, and BBMF would turn north and head out over RAFM and the rest of the formations would turn over Fulham and head out to the NW and fly over RAF Northolt.

[Deep Throat]

Only since the 100th Anniversary of the RAF flypast, which was routed over LHR, and ever since the Trooping one and any otehrs have followed suit.
Prior to that for many, many years only the helo's and BBMF would peel off pdq and helo's would turn south and follow the river, and BBMF would turn north and head out over RAFM and the rest of the formations would turn over Fulham and head out to the NW and fly over RAF Northolt.

Perhaps EGLL would like to be 'available' from the start, rather than take a bird/drone strike amongst their downbounds inside 12 miles - it's not far - if Northolt is not an option and you don't want a dip in the Thames

[Video Mixdown]

Perhaps EGLL would like to be 'available' from the start, rather than take a bird/drone strike amongst their downbounds inside 12 miles - it's not far - if Northolt is not an option and you don't want a dip in the Thames
I should think flying over Central London in any single engine aircraft is a little bit twitchy. The pilot must be constantly updating his/her plan for if it all goes quiet - "what do I do now......and now.......and now" etc. At low level over the countryside I guess ejecting (for those equipped) would be Plan A, but over the city? Any pilots with experience care to elaborate? Maybe it's something they don't like to talk about.

[Mogwi]

I should think flying over Central London in any single engine aircraft is a little bit twitchy. The pilot must be constantly updating his/her plan for if it all goes quiet - "what do I do now......and now.......and now" etc. At low level over the countryside I guess ejecting (for those equipped) would be Plan A, but over the city? Any pilots with experience care to elaborate? Maybe it's something they don't like to talk about.

Always eject in time! If you have time, aim at the clearest area available - but there is no point in riding the jet in; that won’t help anyone.

Mog

[Dave Gittins]

Years ago I flew from Luton to Biggin a few times via the London City overhead at 2000 in a PA-28 and it's surprising how much green space there is if you fly an aeroplane that lands slow enough.

[Deep Throat]

I should think flying over Central London in any single engine aircraft is a little bit twitchy. The pilot must be constantly updating his/her plan for if it all goes quiet - "what do I do now......and now.......and now" etc. At low level over the countryside I guess ejecting (for those equipped) would be Plan A, but over the city? Any pilots with experience care to elaborate? Maybe it's something they don't like to talk about.

Always eject in time! If you have time, aim at the clearest area available - but there is no point in riding the jet in; that won’t help anyone.

Mog

How far will a Hawk go? Not knowing speed/height they do down the Mall

[Timelord]

An ex Red of my acquaintance tells me his plan was to go for the river and eject late once he was sure where the aircraft would go.

[Ninthace]

How big is the Buck House lawn? :=

[Deep Throat]

How big is the Buck House lawn? :=


https://www.forces.net/services/raf/pictures-raf-paint-sky-red-white-and-blue-kings-official-birthday-celebration

A few pics down the page - perhaps good for a Chinook - and empty on the day

Was occupied for the Coronation

[treadigraph]

Only since the 100th Anniversary of the RAF flypast, which was routed over LHR, and ever since the Trooping one and any otehrs have followed suit.
Prior to that for many, many years only the helo's and BBMF would peel off pdq and helo's would turn south and follow the river, and BBMF would turn north and head out over RAFM and the rest of the formations would turn over Fulham and head out to the NW and fly over RAF Northolt.
Ah OK, always assumed they did the same thing in the past. I saw the 75th from St James's Park, the 100th from Victoria Park up Mile End Road and the Coronation from Putney Bridge when they were already dispersing; other than that I've seen the odd ToC in the past from 10 miles away if I happened to doing some unpaid over time on a Saturday - had a nice view across the west end did my old office...

The Spitfires and Hurricane are expected to ditch in the Thames which with the Spit apparently means a pretty quick trip to the bottom; have to hope the tide is out and land in the shallows, I imagine landing on the mud might not end well.

[Easy Street]

There was a time when the only single engined jets in the flypast were RAFAT, and the argument went that their pilots were talented enough to be able to deposit an ailing steed into the Thames at any stage of the flypast and bang out just in time. All other ejection seat equipped aircraft in the flypast had the benefit of at least two engines. I stand ready to be corrected, but I don't recall ever having seen a Harrier in a Buck House flypast. (The EIIR Tucanos were over Windsor Castle, before anyone cites them.)

These days: black Hawk T2s, Texans, F35s, all over London. What's changed? Don't say engine reliability... at least not in the Hawk's case...

[GeeRam]

There was a time when the only single engined jets in the flypast were RAFAT, and the argument went that their pilots were talented enough to be able to deposit an ailing steed into the Thames at any stage of the flypast and bang out just in time. All other ejection seat equipped aircraft in the flypast had the benefit of at least two engines. I stand ready to be corrected, but I don't recall ever having seen a Harrier in a Buck House flypast.

Yep, don't ever recall seeing Harriers in any Trooping flypast....?
However, I seem to recall there were RAF/RN Harriers taking part in the Falklands Victory flypast over London in Oct '82, as well as there being a Harrier formation element in the massive 50th Anniversary of BofB flypast in Sept 1990, that continued out to Abingdon for the BofB airshow....??

[Geezers of Nazareth]

Yep, don't ever recall seeing Harriers in any Trooping flypast....?
However, I seem to recall there were RAF/RN Harriers taking part in the Falklands Victory flypast over London in Oct '82, as well as there being a Harrier formation element in the massive 50th Anniversary of BofB flypast in Sept 1990, that continued out to Abingdon for the BofB airshow....??

Harriers in London flypasts -
October 1982 'Falklands' flypast included two Harrier GR.3s and two Sea Harrier FRS.1s;
1990 BoB flypast, formation #4 included three 'box 4s' of Harrier GR.5s and 1 'box 4' of RN Sea Harrier FRS.1;
in August 1994 there was a VJ day flypast which included two RAF Harrier GR.5s;
in June 1997 the Queen's Birthday Flypast included two 20 Sqdn GR.7s;
in June 1998 the Queen's Birthday Flypast included two GR.7s;

I am reasonably certain that this is all the times that Harrier (of all marks) have taken place in flypasts. I'd still like to identify exactly which aircraft flew. Does anyone out there have these flypasts in their log-books?

[Easy Street]

Interesting set of dates. Looks like someone was prepared to make an exception to the norm for the "special" flypasts in 1982, 1990 and 1994. More understandable than the 1997 and 1998 birthdays, never to be repeated. With 2 years being roughly the length of an air marshal's tour, I wonder if the holder of the relevant "risk-holding" post at the time was uniquely determined to see Harriers taking part even in "routine" flypasts, and if their successor's return to the previous norm was made easier by the run of Harrier losses in the mid-90s!

("Risk holding" in inverted commas as there would undoubtedly have been some wriggling off the hook after a crash in those pre-Duty Holder days...)

[treadigraph]

I saw the 75th from St James's Park

Looking at Geezer's post and thinking about it, that must actually have been the BoB 50th, 1990... Recall several desert pink Buccs which got a particular cheer?

Edit: apparently this list includes the aircraft in the 1990 London Flypast: https://www.scramble.nl/database/show-reports/united-kingdom/abingdon-1990

[Geezers of Nazareth]

Looking at Geezer's post and thinking about it, that must actually have been the BoB 50th, 1990... Recall several desert pink Buccs which got a particular cheer?

Edit: apparently this list includes the aircraft in the 1990 London Flypast: https://www.scramble.nl/database/show-reports/united-kingdom/abingdon-1990

It was indeed the 50th anniversary flypast/commemoration of the BoB. I seem to remember that there was a lot of chatter at the time about the MoD/RAF insisting that every 'still active' squadron which took part in 1940 should send aircraft for the flypast ... and somebody mentioned 'Harriers' and their 'engine out glide ratio'. I assume that there was some interesting conversations and meetings. Up until that point the only Harriers in London flypasts had been the RN and RAF ones in 1982 (... unless you know different).
Various enthusiast groups were invited to send representatives to almost all the departure airfields to record the comings and goings; for my sins I was despatched to Wattisham to see all the Phantoms depart. It turned out to be a blessing as all the fixed wing formations flew just to the south of us on the run-in. My instructions were 'take lots of photos', but sadly the developers were not quite so careful with my efforts. I'd love to have a time machine and a digital camera