Air Pictorial scans

[Discorde]

https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/800x260/air_pic_points_v4_sm_bd908798b2742bc1fd9614f896ab99971176d40 5.jpg
Air Pictorial scans are now available. See post #17 for link.

[wrecker]

A great resource

[XV490]

These really take me back. Thank you to whoever put the work in to make them available.
👍

[paulross]

That is wonderful, I really appreciate the enourmous effort that has gone into this. I think that it great that we can have a digital record of these historic publications. Perhaps it is just me, but I was fascinated by the adverts in these magazines.

Great job and thank you.

[Asturias56]

a gold mine for "what aircraft", "what cockpit" etc etc :}

[Planemike]

September 1962........was my first purchase of "" Air Pic """!! . Bought it regularly for quite a few years. All stashed away in the loft......!!!

Thank you Discorde. !! How about going backwards into the 50s....??

[Asturias56]

Great insulation

[goldox]

Air Pic was a must for me in the late 60's/early 70s.
Reminds me that a teacher nicked my copy on the school coach to our sports fields in Surrey. Must have been 1968 or 69.
He wanted to know what I was reading (it was an article on the Cessna 152/172 if I recall).
Suddenly he took an interest in it and borrowed my copy - I never got it back!

Once the scans get to the late 60s I will have to look out for that one and finish reading the article!

Excellent piece of work Discorde - many thanx!

[treadigraph]

Cheers Discorde!

Rather taken with the image of the Beechcraft 120, a turboprop Queen Air with Turbomeca Bastans... The resemblance to the Swearingen Merlin II which a new fuselage sat on Queen Air wings (and was a progression from his Excalibur QA modification) is quite marked!

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/500x220/beech_120_9df03d7d0d8db43e9313316433d11c3864d64376.jpg

Edit: just looked this up in Rod Simpson's book, pic must be a mock-up as the prototype was never built.

[nwesterntown]

Just wow
Thank you!

[Noyade]

Beechcraft 120, a turboprop Queen Air with Turbomeca Bastans


A 3-view from Jane's...


https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/800x651/scan1167_96bba798d6e5baad6768f3065d87f51429a36dbb.jpg

[By George]

Thanks, Discorde, Great job. I grew up on those magazines and what a wealth of information they contained. Funny to look at them now and how wrong many people in the industry were. All those VTOL dreams for one. Fascinating, and thanks again.

[57mm]

Great work, thank you. Nostalgia is definitely what it used to be!

[Discorde]

This post has been superseded.

[megan]

A magnificent piece of work Discorde, thank you. Now, if we could only have someone resurrect the "Flight" files life would be complete.

[Noyade]

Thank you Discorde - much appreciated.

[Discorde]

This tranche of Air Pictorial scans (Sep 1962 - Apr 1965) has now been completed. It's possible that earlier and later editions will be added in the future.

Air Pictorial (https://www.steemrok.com/airpic/)

Points of interest (https://www.steemrok.com/airpic/airpicPOI.html)

[arthur harbrow]

Those are great, thank you very much.

[lindholme]

What a magnificent thing to do - thank you!

[Discorde]

This scan of the Ian Allan Civil Aircraft Markings 1960 edition (https://www.steemrok.com/CAM/CAM1960.html) might be of interest among aviation historians and enthusiasts.

While some of the light aircraft on the register might still be able to fly it's unlikely that many, if any, of the airliners are now airworthy. Maybe a DC-3 or two?

[treadigraph]

Blimey, that is a treasure to bring pleasure! I reckon nearly all of the aircraft on the first UK page still exist - if not entirely completely! I'll have a proper gander later...

Cheers!

[barry lloyd]

Discorde, you are a hero! Who does one write to recommend you for a knighthood? :) I can merely echo the comments of those above.

[treadigraph]

Only two that I can see on that first G- page that are no longer with us in some form - Tiger G-ACEZ (and I'm not sure it is definitely totally completely kaput, think I've seen reference to its continued existence in "kit" form) and the DH-86 G-ACZP which was damaged on a Viv Bellamy organised trip to Madrid in the '60s and eventually scrapped sadly. One aeroplane belongs to a regular on these august pages...

The Avia 'BEE is in Australia and I believe DH-60 'BJJ and DH-89 'CPP are both in Canada. The Klemm 'AXK is believed to be stored somewhere in Kent, damaged in '62 and its last registered owner had died. The former Chrisair DH-84 G-ADDI is in the US.

Edit: G-ABJJ is back in the UK with Ben Cox!

[DaveReidUK]

Fascinating stuff !

Re surviving airliners, I can't think of any ex G- examples off the top of my head, although there may be a few. A handful survive from the Overseas Airline Fleet Lists, albeit not airworthy: an Air France 707, SAS Caravelle and Qantas 707, possibly others.

I was pleased to see among the photos a nice one of our local resident:

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/1396x673/g_apwa_9e443c7e9e41f35148a9abe479e7d0e320e747f6.jpg
Note the "Four Darts". :O

Also of interest is what must be one of the very first G- out-of-sequence registrations: G-ARWG, a Druine/Rollason Condor registered to Roy Watling Greenwood.

[Discorde]

Fascinating stuff !

Re surviving airliners, I can't think of any ex G- examples off the top of my head, although there may be a few. A handful survive from the Overseas Airline Fleet Lists, albeit not airworthy: an Air France 707, SAS Caravelle and Qantas 707, possibly others.

I was pleased to see among the photos a nice one of our local resident:

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/1396x673/g_apwa_9e443c7e9e41f35148a9abe479e7d0e320e747f6.jpg
Note the "Four Darts". :O


As you'll be aware the Herald originally appeared powered by four Leonides piston engines, which probably accounts for the erroneous caption. I've photoshopped a correction.

'Know Your Airliners' Handley Page Herald (https://www.steemrok.com/KYA/KYAcontentsnv.html#herald)

[VictorGolf]

Well done that man. Interesting that Rapide G-AIDL and Sptfire G-AIDN were operating with Classic Wings at Duxford last year on passenegr experience flights.

[treadigraph]

Sabena had a surprisingly large fleet.

[condor17]

Sept '63 has been brought to our notice . One of our Rofs [ retired old fogies ] still has an Aeronca which came to the UK on floats ; donated to the Sea Tiger [ article in Sep'63 ] .
Further down in a/c registrations .. Restored to register is a Dh 60G Moth ... She's still happily a/b at our local a/d [ close to where she was then based ] , now owned and flown by the son of the '63 restorer .
Like so many , had to save up from Saturday job ... It was a tossup between Air Pic , Airfix mag , Airfix kit , saving for a motorbike in 3 yrs time !

rgds condor .

[treadigraph]

Used to regularly see that Aeronca "floating" around near my school in the late '70s when it lived on the strip at Tongham - see it lives even closer to my Alma Mater now! Only saw its former floats once when the Sea Tiger made a low pass or two at White Waltham. The only other time I saw the Sea Tiger, it was just a fuselage being debent at Redhill after its first accident, think it was also modified then to permit a quick swap between floats and wheels.

[CISTRS]

Very many thanks indeed.

[India Four Two]

What on earth did Aviation Traders do with all those Prentices?

I see that G-AORF, the first Chipmunk I flew, was once owned by Viv Bellamy.

[mikemmb]

What on earth did Aviation Traders do with all those Prentices?
.

I remember huge piles of them on the Southend dump (even more at Stanstead) and my first ever flight was in the 7 seater!

[chevvron]

What on earth did Aviation Traders do with all those Prentices?

I remember an article in a magazine not yet mentioned - Meccano Magazine of about 1960 or '61 - where one of them set off for Australia with a husband and wife who were emigrating. It was named 'Koomela' (presumably oz); don't remember its reg.
There was some discussion as to whether they would get there using the 'original' RAF 4 - channel VHF radio especially as they only had limited crystals which did not include 121.5.
Always wondered if they got there.
I only ever saw a Prentice once when I was controlling at the PFA Rally at Cranfield one year.

[chevvron]

Used to regularly see that Aeronca "floating" around near my school in the late '70s when it lived on the strip at Tongham.
I remember that, I think it was G-AREF; it was operating from Tongham/Runfold when I first arrived at Farnborough in '74; always called us up before takeoff in case there was traffic in the Farnborough circuit. There was a Stearman (G-AZLE) at the other Tongham strip, Whitelane Farm about 2 miles east and I think this moved to Runfold when Whitelane Farm closed along with an Aviat Husky.

[treadigraph]

G-AREX it was, didn't realise there were two strips at Tongham, thought the Stearman was at Runfold too.

Three of the Prentices (Prentii?) ended at Biggin, I recall two fliers there when I first visited, one was and still is owned by Susan Saggers, the other is now part of the RAF Museum collection; a third seems to have been owned by Cobby Moore and I only ever recall it as a hulk outside the Surrey Aviation hangar.

The vast majority were scrapped at Southend or Stansted; seem to recall Freddy Laker thought civilianising them would provide a cheap light aircraft for the air minded masses but there was no market. Only about a dozen survived the axeman I think. There's video on YouTube of one decreasingly low passes at a Barton airshow in 1959 - eventually the pilot essayed a slow roll which ended in a burning heap of scrap metal.

Edit: 252 bought by Aviation Traders, 28 were converted according to Wikipedia.

[chevvron]

Ah yes, Echo X ray.
At least I got the first bit right!
Whereas Runfold was east - west on the line of the Hogs Back, Whitelane Farm was one way; land southerly towards the Hogs Back and take off northerly away from the Hogs Back.
A friend of mine happened to drive round there one day in about '76 and there was a Twin Comanche nose poking through the hedge!!

[India Four Two]

The vast majority were scrapped at Southend or Stansted; seem to recall Freddy Laker thought civilianising them would provide a cheap light aircraft for the air minded masses but there was no market.

Thanks treadigraph. It seems odd that he would register them all or were the registrations just place holders?

My second-ever flight was a joyride in a Prentice at the late-lamented Ramsgate Airport. A bit of a letdown after my first flight, which was in a Dragon Rapide!

[treadigraph]

The seven seater Prentice seems to have been G-APJE, Chrisair operated their famous red DH-84 Dragon G-ADDI from Ramsgate in 1963 and also a Prentice; Biggin Hill's Jock Maitland also did Prentice joyrides from Ramsgate, bit earlier I think.

Not sure I'd heard of Ramsgate Airport before, probably thought references meant Manston!

[India Four Two]

Not sure I'd heard of Ramsgate Airport before, probably thought references meant Manston!

Ramsgate was a wonderful grass airfield, with an amazing Art Deco terminal building, which was pulled down by the Philistines who turned the airfield into an industrial area.

Present day:
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/2000x1408/ramsgate_airport_ca423f0703187800667894192d99691b87cca3e1.jp eg

1959:
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/2000x1667/ramsgate_airport_1959_8ca5b479563cedadb975d3e9db6882faafad7a bb.jpg


https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/640x397/ramsgate_terminal_1_c3bd43ba704c71e949e48fea31192bf90232620b .jpg

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/2000x1471/ramsgate_terminal_2_852f65857f129a891a686c0d3a210ddcab66771a .jpg

Some more evocative photos here:
https://aviationarchives.info/category/RamsgateMunicipleAirport

A very interesting history. Whitney Straight was one of the original owners:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ramsgate_Airport

[treadigraph]

That terminal is a beauty!

(Speaking of Art Deco, the famous Purley Way lido is just over the hill from here - when the site was demolished in the 1980s to make way for a gardening centre, the Art Deco diving platform was left intact and I believe is now under a preservation order. Another redevelopment into a housing estate looms, arranged about this monument to 1930s taste...)

[India Four Two]

Ahem, ... was a beauty!

[treadigraph]

I like to keep my rose-tinted spectacles positive!

[Discorde]

Noteworthy that in the BOAC Britannia 102 sequence G-ANBA to 'BO there is no 'BG registered. Internet research shows photo evidence of 'BG in BOAC colours but the aircraft was later re-registered as G-APLL. Some sources suggest the change was demanded by superstitious pilots who were not keen to fly an aircraft whose reggie was an acronym for 'No Bloody Good'. Unable to establish whether this is merely an aviation myth.

[Discorde]

The (free access) 1957 spotters' book 'Know Your Airliners (https://www.steemrok.com/KYA/KYA.html)' has been re-formatted and is now more user-friendly.

[Jhieminga]

Noteworthy that in the BOAC Britannia 102 sequence G-ANBA to 'BO there is no 'BG registered. Internet research shows photo evidence of 'BG in BOAC colours but the aircraft was later re-registered as G-APLL. Some sources suggest the change was demanded by superstitious pilots who were not keen to fly an aircraft whose reggie was an acronym for 'No Bloody Good'. Unable to establish whether this is merely an aviation myth.
I have this on my website, below a listing of all the BOAC/BA VC10s:
Looking through the list of registrations above, one may wonder why the registration G-ARVD was never allocated to a VC10. A logical answer would be that this one was already in use, but BOAC obviously used 'blocks' of registrations so surely this one would have been included. The true answer was revealed in the August 2003 issue of 'Aeroplane' by Mike Stroud in a review of a book about the Bristol Britannia. The seventh Series 102 Britannia was re-registered G-APLL in favour of its original registration of G-ANBG, and this was due to an overly puritanical lady in charge of allocating registrations at the ARB who felt that this would encourage disrespect and swearing ("No Bloody Good"). For some reason she let through G-AOVD for a Series 312 Britannia, but later on the intended G-ARVD was never allocated as she felt that the last two letters were equally unacceptable in nice company.
From: https://www.vc10.net/History/historyBOAC.html
I'm not sure whether I still have that issue of Aeroplane lying about... but that's where I found it.

[Planemike]

The Klemm 'AXK is believed to be stored somewhere in Kent, damaged in '62 and its last registered owner had died. <br /><br />Edit: ! <br /><br />Anything more detailed than this available... ???<br />

[treadigraph]

A J Jackson has it "stored in Sevenoaks" in 1972. I no longer have any Air Britain registers which might have had some more info if it still survives; it was cancelled by the CAA in 1991, the late owner lived in Underriver. I suspect it may have been disposed by somebody who knew not what they were doing but you never know.

[DaveReidUK]

A J Jackson has it "stored in Sevenoaks" in 1972. I no longer have any Air Britain registers which might have had some more info if it still survives; it was cancelled by the CAA in 1991, the late owner lived in Underriver. I suspect it may have been disposed by somebody who knew not what they were doing but you never know.

The Klemm was damaged (I don't know how badly) in a hangar collapse at White Waltham in March 1962.

It was seen in Coventry in 1968:

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/708x446/klemm_27e2b59579f9bf2ee652bf1fde1601f2ea9234c9.jpg

[Planemike]

Thank you both for responses. Interested to see the photograph in Coventry. It still appears on G-INFO with the "Underriver" address and owner shown as "deceased". The whereabouts of the a/c have always intrigued me. Over the years I have expected it to reappear as someone's rebuild project (looks like it very nearly achieved that status, hence it's presence in Coventry) or possibly as some skeletal remains in a museum.... It receives a mention in W&Rs 7, 8 ; 9, one report as "just a fuselage". "Reading between the lines" I suspect the wings were w/o / destroyed in the hangar collapse at White Waltham in 1962. Not impossible to have built a new pair of wings. Still wonder what, if anything has survived some fifty years on.. /&gt;<br />

[treadigraph]

Fuselage certainly looks in quite good nick there! Wooden wings I presume?

Cant believe anybody would have junked but I guess if serious rot had set in... Sort of thing that the late Ron Souch or his son Mike would have happily added to the queue. Perhaps Mike has...?

[Discorde]

I have a recollection of seeing 'XK (dismantled) at Biggin Hill in 1959 or thereabouts during a visit with three school chums (it's underlined in red ink in my Ian Allan). Not sure of the ident of this a/c. The 7-seater Prentice?


https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/1266x896/1959e_bg_mg_biggin_4774f2c53194d75d88a8a57b5395eb9bb0dba291. jpg

[treadigraph]

Looks like G-AOLR, 'OMF or most likely 'PIU which seems to have joined S&K at Biggin in 1959 - the other two appeared there in '60.

[Discorde]

Looks like G-AOLR, 'OMF or most likely 'PIU which seems to have joined S&K at Biggin in 1959 - the other two appeared there in '60.

Perhaps 'MF or 'LR then, which are two of five Prentices underlined in my Ian Allan.

[DaveReidUK]

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/1024x694/g_aomf_6783bbdbe21d91493bd1f3a870cdfb10b4a3bff0.jpg

[Planemike]

I have a recollection of seeing 'XK (dismantled) at Biggin Hill in 1959 or thereabouts during a visit with three school chums (it's underlined in red ink in my Ian Allan). Not sure of the ident of this a/c. The 7-seater Prentice? https://abpic.co.uk/pictures/view/1095011
PS......<br />Many thanks Discorde for putting the scans on here. Both interesting and useful.... PM<br />

[Planemike]

Noteworthy that in the BOAC Britannia 102 sequence G-ANBA to 'BO there is no 'BG registered. Internet research shows photo evidence of 'BG in BOAC colours but the aircraft was later re-registered as G-APLL. Some sources suggest the change was demanded by superstitious pilots who were not keen to fly an aircraft whose reggie was an acronym for 'No Bloody Good'. Unable to establish whether this is merely an aviation myth.
In the version told to me, it was passengers who bestowed the soubriquet onto the unfortunately registered Britannia....!!

[DaveReidUK]

In the version told to me, it was passengers who bestowed the soubriquet onto the unfortunately registered Britannia....!!

Well the pilots would need to know the registration of the aircraft they were flying; I suspect that passengers in those days took as little interest in it as they do nowadays.

[Jhieminga]

<br /><br />In the version told to me, it was passengers who bestowed the soubriquet onto the unfortunately registered Britannia....!!<br />
See my post #45 (https://www.pprune.org/11533092-post45.html) above. We can't ask Mike Stroud anymore, but I'm willing to believe the statement.

[DaveReidUK]

See my post #45 (https://www.pprune.org/11533092-post45.html) above. We can't ask Mike Stroud anymore, but I'm willing to believe the statement.

Your comment about G-ARVD never being allocated to a VC-10 due to sensitivities is interesting. I guess we'll never know for sure, but I'd always assumed that BOAC didn't want another Victor Delta in the fleet for the same reason that BA's G-EUP_ series Airbuses don't include a Papa India.

[treadigraph]

G-ASVD, ATVD, AVVD appear not to have been allocated either, didn't look any further.

[dixi188]

Strange that VD is not used these days, STD instead.

[Planemike]

DaveReidUK &amp; Jhierminga.... The points made in your threads noted. PM

[BEagle]

Strange that VD is not used these days, STD instead.

I thought that STD was some form of telephone system?

[DaveReidUK]

G-ASVD, ATVD, AVVD appear not to have been allocated either, didn't look any further.

The following are current::

G-AMVD Auster 5
G-BYVD Grob G115E Tutor
G-CBVD Cameron C-60
G-CDVD Evektor EV-97 Eurostar
G-CEVD Rolladen-Schneider LS3
G-CGVD Van's RV-12
G-CJVD Team Mini-Max 1600
G-CKVD Rolladen-Schneider LS1-f
G-CLVD Schempp-Hirth Discus-2c FES
G-HRVD CCF T-6 Harvard Mk.4
G-NHVD Leonardo AW169

all but one registered in the last 30 or so years.

[treadigraph]

Presumably the alleged puritanical keeper of the Reggie Ledger had retired by the time the later G-B registration blocks were allocated in the early 1990s! G-BUVD was a 1992 Jetstream 31, 'BSVD and 'BTVD not allocated... G-APVD was a WS-51 registered in '59

[pax britanica]

BEAGLE

It was 'Subscriber Trunk Dialing back in the day or real phones with dials, ie you didnt have to clal the operator any more.
Loved the old Air Pic , the one with the 727-100 on cover immediately caught my eye , I was 12 and cycled from home to HAtton cross to see the new BOAC VC10s mentioned in the registration changes section at the old BOAC base at Hatton Cross, LHR.

PB

[Discorde]

There are probably other examples of 'disrespectful' alternate reggies. The original Britannia Airways B737-200s (delivered 1968-9) were getting a little weary by the time they were sold on (mid 1980s). G-AVRM was (sort of) affectionately known as 'Rigor Mortis'.

[Planemike]

There are probably other examples of 'disrespectful' alternate reggies. The original Britannia Airways B737-200s (delivered 1968-9) were getting a little weary by the time they were sold on (mid 1980s). G-AVRM was (sort of) affectionately known as 'Rigor Mortis'.<br />For a while Westland S51 1A Dragonfly (serial no:<span style="color:#444444;">WA/H/90)</span> flitted around wearing the marks G-ANAL ( I am sure I have seen a photograph) until it alighted on the more mundane marks G-ANZL. It would have made the perfect mate for G-AR*E ( that, of course, was not issued) !!<br />

[treadigraph]

For a while Westland S51 1A Dragonfly (serial no:WA/H/90) flitted around wearing the marks G-ANAL ( I am sure I have seen a photograph)
If I recall aright, there is one in Pat Malone's excellent biography of Alan Bristow who flew demo flights in it while working for Westlands.

[Planemike]

Presumably the alleged puritanical keeper of the Reggie Ledger had retired by the time the later G-B registration blocks were allocated in the early 1990s! G-BUVD was a 1992 Jetstream 31, 'BSVD and 'BTVD not allocated... G-APVD was a WS-51 registered in '59<br /> This one escaped the net as well....... "https://abpic.co.uk/pictures/view/1098490 The aircraft still flies but with the more prosaic marks TJ565......&lt;br /&gt;<br />

[Jhieminga]

Going back to the Britannia, here are the original registration entries:

https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/1924x1248/screenshot_2023_11_08_at_16_00_44_86d747b8d5f4e1b7b2376e698d c25249ad2e81f7.png
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/1870x928/screenshot_2023_11_08_at_16_01_06_248beee67bc74b5924695737e7 aabb52c4f8e9f8.png
The aircraft was registered for a while under the original marks, up to the change on 19-3-1958. The VC10s were all registered throughout 1962, 1963 and 1964 but the reservations for that block of registration marks may well have been processed years earlier, the first order for VC10s was signed in 1958. I looked up some photos of the Britannia and found some that showed two different livery variations and one underneath which the photographer mentioned that the registration change was due to BOAC's problems with the type. So whether it was a puritanical lady, the public image of BOAC or superstition, I guess there was something around in the late 1950s that led to some registrations being skipped, and at least one changed.

[DaveReidUK]

The aircraft still flies but with the more prosaic marks TJ565

The Auster is of course still on the civil register as G-AMVD, but as with many historical aircraft that have a military connection (real or wannabe), it has an exemption from the CAA that allows it to display a military serial in lieu of its civil registration.