Officer Promotion (RAF)

[ON SBY]

Hi Guys,
Could anyone give me an idea of a promotion timescale from Acting Plt Off to Flt Lt for Aircrew? Also, when do you start getting flying pay? Is it from when you graduate flying training?
Rgds,
ON SBY

[Dr Schlong]

If you do not have the requisite degree in basket weaving then the promotion is as follows;

From IOT graduation - 1yr as Acting Plt Off
Followed by another year as Plt Off before becoming a Fg Off 2 yrs after leaving IOT. You then spend 3.5 yrs as a Fg Off before becoming a Flt Lt.

With a degree - you graduate as Plt Off for 4 days (!), 2 yrs as Fg Off and then get you're Flt Lt (or only 1 yr as Fg Off if you have a Master's).

As far as Flying Pay goes, for Pilots you receive Flying Pay 72 weeks after the commencement of your first flying related course (attending Henlow pre JEFTS groundschool probably). Holds between courses are only included up to a certain number of weeks (varies between FJ, RW and ME), can be complicated but see someone in personnel and it should be explained.

Hope that helps!

[MOA]

Dr

I think the rules have changed again. Surprisingly they have moved further to the right! I recall reading that to qualify you have to complete an OCU:eek:

This could have been a suggestion, but have read so many ideas, new working plans that I am loosing track!

[LoeyDaFrog]

Dr S, sorry but your info is a bit out of date. Whilt I'm not of the two winged variety of JO, the rules were the same whatever you were going to become. Leave Cranditz as an Acting Plt OfF, get substantive Plt Off after 6 months, then do two years before getting Fg Off. It is then four years to Flt Lt. The beancounters recently changed the rules on flying pay and you don't now get it untl you finish whatever OCU you end up at. I know this from my time at the secret scottish base, where most of my mates from IOT were learning to fly tonkas. Strange world, i was at the end of my first tour and they had yet to start theirs. They were all (quite rightly) whinging about this latest change pay etc.

[Talk Reaction]

HAve to say I'm with the Doc on this one. DE on commisioning 5.5 years to Flt Lt, as he said, 1 APO 1 PO 3.5 FG OFF et voilla (sorry not french profficient) = 5.5 years
Something to do with accelerated promotion on the basis of not really needing time thru ranks on account of having no chaps to look after.

Shame about the flying pay thing though

On the subject of JO rank structure, wasn't there some ongoing rumour about the dissolving of all POs, that's the rank not the poorly paid but oh so highly valued individuals.... ;)

[teeteringhead]

I think I heard the same buzz as Talk Reaction. The way I heard it, rank would be divorced from pay in the early stages. Plot was something like: Plt Off until completion of professional training; Fg Off for first productive tour; and Flt Lt for 2nd tour onwards (or forever as the case may be!). Pay increases would be time and NOT rank related. It would have the advantage that (in theory) a flt lt would know a hawk from a handsaw, and not necessarily be a graduate in "Origami with Polynesian Studies" in the backlog.

Turning to Flying Pay, I think not getting it 'til post-OCU is fair (you're still a stude for fox ache), particularly if it was the only way to get more FP for productive aircrew. Personally I'd have gone further, and not given ANY FP initially, up to the halfway point (in numbers) of qualified aircrew (probably about the 8 year point?). Net result, double flying pay thereafter, which might just have kept a few more people in.

After all (and seriously) I hope military aviators don't join for the money. (Although I appreciate it keeps them in.) I recall a particularly exhilarating low level tac formation on a sunny day in training, when I said to my instructor: "You know, I'm amazed we're being paid for this!"

Trouble was, he replied: "Some days Bloggs, I'm amazed they pay YOU at all!" :) :( :)

[Oldandbold]

Diverging slightly from this topic, I was at Cranditz recently and met an Act Plt Off who had recently graduated from IOT and was awaiting courses etc.

I was appalled to hear that because of the miniscule pay, and the fact that he had a family, he was on benefit. What are the services coming to when a serviceman (of any rank) has to claim benefit (family credit etc) in order to survive? He did not have a degree and was joining a ground branch so no fast-track promotion and flying pay for him.

Some will say it was his choice to join, which I agree with, but surely there is a minimum standard of lifestyle that we expect any employed person to have. Conditions have changed since the days I was an APO, sooo long ago!

[Talk Reaction]

I was an APO not too far back in my memory and was the lowest paid individual on the sqn I held on, not just the commisioned ranks. But I was just 19, had never had any money before and certainly didn't have a family to look after..... Of course the APO you mention claiming benefit still has to join that little club called a mess, depending on where that could cost him 30 to 60 quid a month without even going in!!

On the subject of flying pay I'm all for more for productive aircrew, who wouldn't want a bit more.. But it's not just the older and bolder that need retaining, there are a lot of `1st and 2nd tourists considering leaving as soon as they can - you can never start too early to retain a professional, maybe if they delayed the dissatisfaction setting in for a few more years....

Didn't there used to be a flying trg pay? Before going onto normal rates after wings/ocu? Before my time....

This is in danger of becoming a flying pay thread........;)

[scroggs]

In 1978/79, Flt Lts with 6 years' seniority, wife and kids, in OMQs, were on rent rebates and other state benefits. It's not new, unfortunately. When no wars are on, no-one wants to pay for the military or its people.

[kbf1]

5.5 years to Flt Lt :eek: With good CRs most DE Army officers can expect to make substantive Capt in 3-4 years, and some even sooner as an acting promotion.